16 Apr 2024 03:15:08
Interesting to see Liverpool fans starting to turn on Klopp after just a handful of bad performances. We've been terrible since last January, yet there are still people on here who'd rather blame everything but Ten Haag for our abysmal performances.
I'm not saying that the way that our club has been run since David Gill left hasn't been shambolic, but pretty much all of the issues that Ten Haag has had to deal with are ones that his predecessors also faced. If anything, I'd say he's been backed much better than any of our post-SAF managers when it comes to transfers. They were still able to implement their own styles of play, even if not all of those styles were effective or entertaining to watch.
16 Apr 2024 05:25:27
redseven
What clag you're chatting.
Ronaldo?
Sancho?
Greenwood?
Sale/ investment?
Not one of his predecessors has dealt with the current pressures relevant to any of that, not one.
While I have resigned myself to the reality that he won't be here next season, he has had a very rough ride.
There are some on here who blame the players and the coaching staff for how abysmal this season has become.
16 Apr 2024 06:42:24
Ork
Ten Hag has caused some of his own problems with his inflexibility, lack of leadership skills, poor ingame management, tactics and what he says.
If he got his tactics right and we could see a pattern emerging he would have had an easy ride. He pushed for players he knew Antony, Malacia, Amarabat, players that made no sense Mount, he was given money and in Antony’s case too much. I no longer have any sympathy for him and after throwing ac19 year old under the bus he should have been fired yesterday.
16 Apr 2024 08:00:18
He, like most of us, is paid to do a job. He isn’t.
He tried and I wanted him to succeed but he is lacking in flexibility, severely lacking tactically, delusional in his comments and has started chucking young kids under the bus.
Sorry but I am firmly in the OUT camp.
16 Apr 2024 08:13:28
Redman
I'm not defending any of that, I'm just answering the BS claim that ten Hag has faced issues that were mostly encountered by his predecessors.
The 4 situations I mentioned and all of their respective complexities have been faced by not one of his predecessors - not one.
He has made some mistakes and deserves the criticism for them, but let's not all talk clag.
16 Apr 2024 10:11:28
Ork. Greenwood was arrested during Rangnick’s tenure, not Ten Haag’s. The lad was never once available for the Dutch disaster, so not like he suddenly had to adapt his non-existent strategy because of the loss. Even if he did, Ragnick also had to deal with this issue.
Ronaldo came in under Ole, who was then forced to find a way to shoehorn him into the starting eleven. The discontent and disruption caused by Ronaldo’s arrival cost Ole his job, so it seems fair to say that he had to deal with this issue. Ten Haag actually had a chance to solve the problem right after he got started, but opted to block Ronaldo’s departure, thus creating an even bigger for himself further down the line.
The Sancho issue was another one caused by Ten Haag. None of his predecessors had to deal with Sancho specifically, but we’ve had our fair share of problematic players over the years. Pogba and Di Maria immediately spring to mind. The former was seemingly backed over Jose, so again Ten Haag actually had it easy when compared to some of those who came before him.
As for recruitment, Ten Haag has been backed more than any of our managers since SAF left. By all accounts, most of our signings have been his choices, and although we are currently dealing with financial constraints that have left us thin in certain parts of the pitch, that’s in large down to us overspending on Ten Haag’s terrible targets. Had he not been too stubborn to work with Ragnick (who had identified plenty of cheaper and better players than the dross we’ve signed under Ten Haag) we wouldn’t be in this mess.
The only one talking “clag” here is you, fella.
16 Apr 2024 10:19:14
Think many Liverpool fans are questioning the timing/ need to announce Klopp's departure so quickly rather than anything else, which I can understand.
16 Apr 2024 10:27:19
Yeah I'm qu6ote sure when klopp leaves nobody will turn up.
Nonsense to say Liverpool fans are turning on him. The man is adored and rightly so after what he's done for the club.
If they only win the league cup fans will be a little discounted I'm sure but imo they are the 3rd best team.
I don't believe that they are turning on him at all. You will always get the odd idiot but klopps Liverpool legacy is very firmly intact as it should be.
16 Apr 2024 10:33:12
There will always be noise around the United manager. Always.
Eth has not had I think either than anybody else.
He created the ronaldo and sancho situations himself and had nobody else to blame for either imo.
I'm mot saying he necessarily did the wrong thing but he created and put oil on those fires imo.
The takeover was difficult for him I'm sure.
The Greenwood issue happened before he arrived
Eth has had the same issues and noise all united managers face.
He did OK with some and bits so OK with others imo.
Imo eth does not use the power of silence enough.
16 Apr 2024 10:41:39
Ken. A lot of people over on the Liverpool page are now saying that Klopp isn’t good enough tactically and that it’s time for a new manager. His substitutions are bad and it’s his fault that the strikers aren’t putting their chances away.
I think a big part of this is down to them trying to take the sting out of his departure and agree that his legacy will remain intact regardless of how the rest of the season goes, but the general tone over there is pretty negative considering they’re only two points off first place and still have a chance of winning a treble (I don’t think they’ll turn things around in Italy, but wouldn’t bet against it) .
16 Apr 2024 12:01:09
The booked stops with the manager, why so many apologists and clag chattery. The lack of accountability and responsibility in modern discourse is saddening. It’s ok to accept someone has failed, it’s not personal. ❄️
So many well put points highlighting EtHs shortcomings above. The man’s not done it, end of story.
16 Apr 2024 13:13:32
Tumble
The power of silence is apt. If ETH hadn’t commented on Sancho it would likely have not escalated and then throwing Garnacho under the bus just was uncalled for. I think he is under pressure and is throwing out excuses and blaming players. To do it to a 19 yr old who has run his bloody socks off for him has really annoyed me. ETH should have kept it shut and that outburst should have been the end of him or hopefully will be.
16 Apr 2024 13:35:56
Not too clever of garnacho either though redman.
I agree on eth it should be another nail in his coffin.
16 Apr 2024 13:50:00
Tumble
Agreed Garnacho should not have liked the tweets. Young angry and frustrated but should not have done it
If ETH drops him for the next game that will be a nail in his coffin as well. You wonder if ETH will just be tough and lack finesse in leadership after it. Needs to handle it carefully and sensitively and not with size 11 boots like he has, except for those that are his favourites of course. We shall see.
16 Apr 2024 14:50:15
Redman I read a theory that eth is looking for a row with garnacho that would enable him to play Anthony.
I don't buy into that at all but nothing would surprise me.
I can't imagine he will be dropped for the semi final so that eth can turn to Anthony.
I think that theory will be well and truly put to bed as BS at the weekend.
16 Apr 2024 18:40:46
Tumble
That would be extreme, can’t see that as such, however, maybe he can use the argument, look at Antony, so stable and reliable, does what I ask him.
I think we don’t know what ETH will do, he reacts aggressively so it wouldn’t surprise me to see Garnacho on the bench, with an excuse he is tired, the opposition are physical. Garnacho has been our out ball, he is being asked to get at the opposition defence, not have any cover whilst doing it, then has to make 80 yard runs to cover others that jog back.
I think on balance Garnacho will start, but if ETH takes him off again like he did last weekend, I suspect we may see the lad start thinking of Real Madrid, who will welcome him with open arms.
16 Apr 2024 20:15:05
redseven
Mate, understand what I'm saying about dynamics.
Greenwood was arrested during Rangnick's tenure and was swiftly suspended. The situation was, for the club, a set condition.
When the charges were dropped, ten Hag was in situ and has since had indecision from upstairs regarding the player - a dynamic that makes this situation unique to ten Hag.
Ronaldo, irrespective of what was said or promised before, decided to conduct that pathetic interview during ten Hag's tenure.
That situation is one that is unique to ten Hag.
You've avoided conceding how unique the Sancho situation is because you're instead conceding no leg to stand on.
Pogba had an argument with Mourinho on the training ground being filmed by a sneaky peeker - that's not a public fallout and therefore a very weak comparison.
Di Maria?
Mate, really? I'm not even going there.
At no point have I said he's not made mistakes, there's a litany of poor decisions, but there are incredibly pertinent dynamics being ignored.
No other manager in our history has had to deal with severe indecision at board level, plus all the subsequent complications, regarding a player who's had serious allegations of a violent nature dropped - not Rangnick or anyone else.
No other manager in our history has had a player dig out their manager and employers on a TV interview - not Ole or Rangnick or anyone else.
No other manager in our history has had their authority publicly challenged on a prime social media platform in the manner displayed by Sancho.
I'm not saying he didn't make things worse for himself, but he has had a rather unique set of complications to deal with.
Perhaps my suggestion that you're chatting clag was a bit bitey, but I 100% stand by what I've just written now - he's had a rough ride that categorically is not all his own doing.
I'm chatting facts - straight up, irrefutable facts.
I think the overarching point being missed is that there are all these managers - some with vast and glorious experience - who have found cliques of players who are perfectly happy to scorch the reputations of anyone who dares stand up to them.
That's not to say the managers have been faultless, but the common denominator is blatantly obvious - precious little runts who probably couldn't spell the word 'professional' throwing every toy they can to get their way.
The significant changes needed at the club do not end at the dugout.
Until the player-power culture has been eradicated there is no hope for any manager of Manchester United - there's another straight up fact.
Where we certainly do agree is on ten Hag's future at season's end - it won't be at OT.
16 Apr 2024 21:01:58
Difference between criticising ETH and Garnacho is that the former is a mature guy with decades of experoand the latter a young guy learning his trade. ETH should have censured Garnacho in private.
17 Apr 2024 09:59:19
Not true on a few of those points ork.
Your second paragraph sums you up. 'Understand what I'm saying'
Perhaps you are being understood but simply disagreed with.
Your not stating facts your staying your opinion.
Fergie had to deal with the abandoned takeover by Knight the the the plc move then the glazer takeover.
Fergie and ron atkinson had to deal with sexual assault allegations against their players Atkinson more than once and other domestic violence situations.
Arrest off the captain on the eve of a cup final and the Cantona debacle.
Fergie had to deal with a player undermining him in a tv interview.
No doubting Eric had a few tricky ones but that's life at united.
No leg to stand on ??? what in a simple post of an opinion??? you have no idea what cliques he has faced no idea at all not the foggiest clue. Fact.
Perhaps the players think your a runt for making too many assumptions that you have no idea about.
Who knows?
Eth has made his own bed on some issues and made it very well others he in my opinion had handled badly.
Like all managers of all clubs.
Ronaldo accused the club of slavery in fergies time. He was wrong then I think a lot of what he said about eth has come out as true.
You have opinions And you sate a couple of facts.
You are very steadfast on your opinion which is fine but they are not all facts and your linings are based on a lot of assumptions like all our opinions looking from the outside in.
Sancho situation was let get out of hand and escalated. That's as much the mangers fault as sanchos.
17 Apr 2024 10:04:55
Back in the day Busby had to deal with prison sexual and domestic violence issues too. Just like many am employer in any walk of life.
Just sayimg.