14 Jul 2024 10:13:55
Rumours that Notts forest are close to signing nikola milinkovic for about 15 million.
I remember we were looking at him at one point. Has that interest completely gone, as 15 million for him is a bargain.
14 Jul 2024 11:14:59
Maybe there is a reason why he is no longer being linked with top clubs for 30-50m and is instead heading to Forest for 15m.
14 Jul 2024 11:29:11
Because the world has woken up to transfer fees? Everyone apart from Everton anyway!
{Ed025's Note - but if you have the Kohinoor Diamond Spenno you dont want sell him to someone offering Cash Converters prices mate.. :)
14 Jul 2024 11:36:41
lol Ed. Maybe Utd got stuck in the queue for him.
{Ed025's Note - its like when you are haggling for prozzie spenno, we know the deed is going to happen its just agreeing a price mate.. :)
14 Jul 2024 12:18:03
Branthwaite will come down to a simple decision.
Is it better to overpay for what you really want, or compromise and spend good money on something else instead.
The reality is that the CB market for a club with ambitions to be amoungst the best is limited.
Players like Max Kilman who is a decent, solid EPL CB is 40m when moving to West Ham. If he was joining a club like United, Arsenal or Chelsea you could add 5-10m to that price.
That is just the way the market is right now. If you are signing a younger player with potential or a top class proven player then you'll likely have to pay upwards of 55-60m.
There might be the odd exception, but you'll struggle to find more than one of those a year.
If we do the maths, there are probably around 25 or so CB's who are good enough for where we want to be. Half of those at least are already playing for a top side and we probably won't be able to get a player from them.
Which leaves maybe 12 viable options. Yet not all of those will be willing to or want to join us. While some of them might have recently moved or signed a new deal meaning they will cost a premium to get them out of there club.
Which all means there are probably about 4 or 5 viable options for us to sign who are all at the level we want/ need or have the potential to get to that level.
If we are looking to sign at least 2 maybe 3 CB's then that really doesn't give us much wiggle room.
Todibo has been ruled out.
MdL seems oddly available, and might be the exception player.
Yoro really wants Real Madrid.
Branthwaite will cost a premium.
But let's say Yoro chooses to turn us down as he wants Madrid (which is rumoured to be the most likely outcome), and we sign MdL.
We still need at least one more CB maybe two.
If we don't agree to pay a little more for Branthwaite then where to we turn?
Marc Guehi is probably one of the few who looks both good enough and potentially available. Will he cost less than 55m? Almost certainly not.
Inacio and Diomande from Sporting both look like potentially good enough prospects, both will also cost 50-60m each. While neither are proven in the EPL like Branthwaite and Guehi. Also both have exceled in a back three system, would they look as good in a back four?
Which other options are there who are both good enough and available?
Calafiori will be joining a UCL club and probably wouldn't consider joining us. Same for Bastoni if he is available.
All other options are a step down in quality and potential.
Which for me seems to bring the question round to whether its better to over pay for Branthwaite and pay 60-65m for him.
Or sign Guehi for 55-60m, Inacio or Diomande for 50-55m, or Antonio Silva who will cost 60-70m, or to sign someone that next level down like Hancko for 35-40m?
Where is the value in that market?
Surely it makes more sense to pay 5-10m more for the younger and potentially better option in Branthwaite than Guehi?
Or 10-15m more to sign Branthwaite than either Inacio or Diomande who have not proven themselves in a back four or in the EPL.
While I don't think dropping down a level to sign the likes of Hancko is really a sensible idea, we need to make sure we are signing players who can become key players in our next title winning side, not place holders until a better player becomes available.
I understand that people have mixed views on Branthwaite, and no one wants the club to over spend on players.
But if not Branthwaite then who do we sign instead?
14 Jul 2024 11:45:21
Maybe Ed, maybe. if he's the one they want it would be silly to lose out over a £10-15m gap in valuation. Maybe there's some middle ground.
{Ed025's Note - he wants to go to United spenno so i think there is a deal to be done mate..
14 Jul 2024 14:14:59
In the whole of world football there surely are really really good defenders. Why can other clubs find them, sign them and a year or so later sell them on at huge profit yet Utd can't find them?
14 Jul 2024 18:02:49
Salford, we have signed players like that, they were Kleberson, Djemba-Djemba, Bebe, Tosic, Prunier, Tiabi, Manucho, Bellion, Forlan, Vidic, Solskjaer, and Johnsen.
Sometimes they work out, but more often than not they aren't able to make the massive jump up.
Football like education has levels, and for the most part you need to build your way through the levels to get to the top. GCSEs, A-levels, Undergrad, Masters, and PhD.
There are the few special talents who could jump from GCSE or A-level right up to PhD. But they are few and far between.
Football is very much the same, players need to build themselves up in terms of technical ability, mentality, and experience before they are ready to take that next step to a massive club like Manchester United. Where the expectations are insane in terms of the level you need to play at and the consistency. While mistakes are amplified and made out to be huge errors.
Most players need a stepping stone club between their first professional club and a global giant club like United.
The biggest issue is the reason these players are cheaper is due to them being more raw, less refined and needing more coaching and development to see if they can step up to that next level. However, to do that they need game time. Which is something that is hard to come by at a top club unless you are performing most weeks.
Other top clubs have taken gambles on players like this, more often than not they end up like Victor Roque at Barcelona rather than Vinicius Junior at Real Madrid.
Even our most recent signings is an example of how it's very difficult for highly talented young players to get the minutes they need to develop at a top club. Zirkzee signed for Bayern, but never really got the game time he needed. A couple of loans and a permanent move later and he finds himself at a "stepping stone club" (absolutely no disrespect meant to Bologna) and with less pressure and more game time he has been able to flourish and show the talent he has.
We had a similar situation with Diego Forlan, highly talented player, but couldn't get the game time or had the freedom to make mistakes at United and he struggled. Then he moves to a club a step down from United and he flourishes and wins the European golden boot.
So sure, there probably are dozens of defenders who aren't quite ready for a step up to the level we will demand that we could sign. But most of them would flop if we did sign them.
I think if you have a thin squad you can afford to maybe sign one player like this a summer to have a gamble on. Knowing that they probably won't work out but you could sell them in a couple of seasons time for a similar amount as long as you don't give them silly wages.
The problem is can we afford to gamble on a player like that in such a key position when we've had the issues we had last season.
14 Jul 2024 18:42:22
Maybe our new coaching set-up can pluck out a blinder from thin air. I bet even Shappy hadn't heard of a certain Vemanja Vidic in 2005.
14 Jul 2024 19:15:40
As a Serbian I can tell u I wouldn't pay more than 30m for him. He's definitely not a top level and plays better in a formation with 3 CBs anyway.
15 Jul 2024 15:16:45
Spenno, to be honest I haven't heard of "Vemanja Vidic" until you mentioned him.
Is he any relation to former Manchester United CB Nemanja Vidic? ???
Jokes aside I mentioned that Vidic was one such success. Unfortunately for every Vidic there are half a dozen Prunier's.
I think it's much harder to pluck an unheard of player out of obscurity now. Far too many scouts scouring the world. Can still happen from time to time, but it's not a common occurrence.
I certainly hope none of the new coaching staff are suggesting transfers. Coaches should coach, leave transfer targets to the scouts and recruitment experts.
15 Jul 2024 17:07:09
Spellling, scouting, coaching, you can do it all Shappy. I'm amazed you're wasted sat at a keyboard all day!
16 Jul 2024 05:19:01
Spenno, I know you're being sarcastic, but you have just described the job of a teacher, which I happen to be ?.