26 May 2015 19:13:28
after the seasons over we the united fans get together to try and make sense of what happened in the season. Then we go on about new signings and strategy and such and whether one transfer or a few transfers can get us back to the top again. But quite simply, no matter whatever system we play we haven't looked comfortable in a game since fergie left. I know it serves no purpose to reminisce about the past but really how good a coach was he. Match after match after match he set up his teams to win and when we watched his teams we knew that they'd never give up. Even when we we lost 6-1 to city it was not for giving up but because we would not stop attacking.And that for me was the heart and soul of ubited. It was our DNA. But in the David Moyes days it felt like all the fight was gone and even now under lvg whenever we concede first we might get back quickly but after 70 odd minutes it seems like the game goes nowhere and that's the opposite of what used to happen in fergies time. Its like we were the kings of late goals and now it feels as if the team stops trying late on in the game. Although, there have been some exceptions like blinds goal that rescued a point at Sunderland these are rare occurrences and that's what worries me that towards the end of games post fergie the game passes us by. As in during fergies days the last 15 would probably be the most exciting whereas now it's the most boring. You might a switch off you TV's and got to sleep because the best we'd probably not concede a goal becoz I am willing to bet we won't be scoring another in all honesty so my point is although lvg has done well he just isn't the right guy for the united way and the English way of 4-4-2 with marauding wingers which would excite us a every point in the match. So I'd say that if we want to get back to winning ways but in a style that the fans will enjoy we need to look for a coach like minded to fergie because its all.and well keeping 90% possession but if you cannot score more than your opponents you will never end up on the winning side. So rather than the players its the philosophy that is to be adjusted for a better Manchester united which plays its football in a way that excites even our most ardent haters because it is the united way
26 May 2015 22:09:16
Fergie always had a difference maker. Cantona, Ronaldo, even RVP for one season. Yes, the team needs an attitude adjustment too, but unless we have top players it doesn't matter what system we play. Chelsea, Arsenal, and City all have deeper and better squads than us, never mind the top European clubs. It's been asked many times: how many of our squad would get a regular first team berth on any of those 3 teams?
Until the last few years SAF also had no trouble recycling players. Beckham, Keane, Van Nistelrooy all got sold, but after the Glazers came in we started to hold on to our old stars, until they could no longer cut it. We became a club prepared to part with Ronaldo, Tevez etc, watching as City and Chelsea started to pack their squads wit international stars. We brought Scholes out of retirement rather than pay Pogba regularly. Why, because, in my opinion, SAF became focused on his short term legacy. He wasn't prepared to take those sort of risks any longer, and I think he knew the players coming through were not as good as the ones who were coming towards the end of their careers. In Europe the deterioration of the squad was especially marked.
I am not defending LVG but i think he deserves another year at least. Let's see who he buys, who he gets rid off and how he sets the team up to play. There is absolutely no point in going on about the past because it cannot be repeated by anyone. And frankly, if we want to be successful in Europe any time in the future, then we are going to have to move away from SAF tactically. His record in Europe was modest at best considering the wealth of the club, and how many times we were in the competition.
{Ed025's Note - thats a cracking post shawthing..well done mate..
26 May 2015 22:39:03
we have spent 200mil in 18 month and we don't have a player that can make a difference ?.
mata and di maria cost 100 mill alone .
fergy won the CL twice i think during that time only barcelona and madrid won it more 3 times each ( i might be wrong on that)
so i think fergys record was ok .
27 May 2015 06:21:38
Shawthing
Agree and I have taken lots of abuse for writing the same over the last three years.
I see SAF has just praised Mourinho as a winner, predicting a period of success for Chelsea under him, add that to the points in your post and the shocking transition SAF guided us into and his legacy is nowhere near as strong as it should be.
27 May 2015 06:57:51
Shawthing
Fergie is in a different class to LVG and i am amused that you can even go there. His record will stand as the greatest manager of his generation and that is why guys like Mourinho even revere him as they understand how difficult it is to achieve what he has done.
I think people are naive to question his record in Europe as even Real Madrid with all its might and money splashed around has proven how difficult it is to get there in Europe. Look at Guardiola at Bayern, who by most accounts is loaded and they get bounced 2 years in a row in embarrassing fashion.
If Fergie was still here and he had spent 200 million, i assure you we would be winning the league or playing for it on the final day of the season. last time Jose was here Fergie saw him off in his 3rd year and Chelsea did the same thing they have been doing for years which is buy buy buy. The script has not changed but one key personality is now retired.
27 May 2015 10:05:56
I've heard it all now - 'Fergie's legacy is nowhere near as strong as it should be'.
Are some of us so determined to excuse LVG everything, that we're prepared to start turning on the man who actually did bring success, rather than question some of the manager's decision-making this season?
27 May 2015 12:25:17
StevieK
SAF's legacy was a team which had not been improved in key positions, then appointing a manager SAF was instrumental in putting in place, who was patently inadequate leading to us finishing 7th. I think it is fair to say his legacy has been tainted by a terrible transition. Now he is praising Mourinho indicating years of success for him whilst having presided over our transition when it is very clear it could and should have been done a lot better. This isn't about hiding what LvG is or hadn't done , it is about SAF dropped the pass and his legacy will be viewed as less successful because of it and even more so if he is right about Chelsea
27 May 2015 15:14:16
Red Man, to be quite honest, SAF could break into my house, shoot my dog, make love to my wife while forcing me to watch, steal all my money, and before leaving, give my son a couple of punches in the face and myself a good, hard kick in the nads, and I'd still give him a bye ball, in light of what he did for our club.
See the revisionism has started already. Ungrateful wouldn't be in it.
27 May 2015 16:10:17
also let's not forget fergys spending was restricted under the glazers while they sorted the debt .
stupid thread imo
27 May 2015 17:42:45
Redman
You views on moyes are so off the chart that you now think fergies' legacy is tainted lol. I assure you you are in tiny tiny tiny minority mate.
Fergie left an old team to be rebuild which in my opining was due in large part because he had very little money to spend. The inability to refinance debt in 2009 to 2011 and interest cost robbed us of 3 years of proper transfer activity as most of the money went for recovering the interest expenses.
In todays age most top teams with settled squads need to buy 2 or 3 top players every year to stay there.
27 May 2015 19:41:34
When talking about SAF being restricted in spending you should remember SAF was also connected with the arrival of the Glazers following his situation with the racehorse. That action tainted him in a lot of eyes. Plus his constant pronouncements that they always supported what he needed undermines your argument.
My views on Moyes were backed up by the board when they sacked him, I don't know anyone who hasn't now accepted that he was out of his depth.
SAF should have won more in Europe, yet he created a marvellous winning culture that we all thoroughly enjoyed. The SAF years were fantastic but he wasn't perfect. His legacy has been tainted following the transition, Moyes appointment, his support for the Glazers and the racehorse situation but we will always rejoice in every trophy he brought us, that side of him will always be appreciated.
28 May 2015 10:33:31
On that basis Mourinho should have also won a lot more in Europe too given his teams at Chelsea and Real madrid. Blank at real and chelsea.
Very easy to say stuff like that. I guess Guardiola should have also won 5 on that basis.