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26 Apr 2024 19:10:21
Ed002 - If you've got time please, even if Utd wanted to sell Rashford or he wanted to leave is there any genuine interest in taking him? Given his current form and massive wages I wouldn't suspect there is a big queue? Thanks in advance.
{Ed002's Note - I am getting sick of answering the same quesions over and over. It is a complete waste of my time.
Marcus Rashford (LW/F) Much will depend on what happens in the summer regarding a new coach, but I am sure Manchester United will be regretting the new long-term contract. A third-party has spoken to clubs, including Juventus and Arsenal about him on behalf of Manchester United, but I am not aware of any serious interest. Suggestion that he could be a Mbappe replacement at PSG seem far-fetched given they have other clear targets in mind.}
1.) 26 Apr 2024 20:38:07
My apologies thanks for your reply.
2.) 26 Apr 2024 21:05:11
More or less our biggest star/ face off our marketing. Can't see us letting him go for a fee that would be anywhere near realistic. Think he will stay and stink up the place ala Martial for the foreseeable.
3.) 27 Apr 2024 08:16:28
His wages too high to be sold.
Maybe short term loan to help him get form back away from spotlight.
4.) 27 Apr 2024 13:17:13
Quite a few contracts on reduced terms have been signed at the likes of Barcelona recently. Maybe de Jong this summer. Most have done so. True measure of love for a club.
5.) 27 Apr 2024 13:18:23
There were rumours he didn’t get on with Greenwood at all and cannot work with him.
Now that’s a tough choice. A lazy and out of form Rashford or Greenwood back?!
6.) 27 Apr 2024 22:07:56
That's not a choice Eric.
7.) 28 Apr 2024 00:20:58
Why not choose between Messi in his prime or Rashford? ?.
8.) 28 Apr 2024 11:08:36
Generally I tend to find it hard to judge players on things beyond their performance on the pitch. Frankly I just don't know enough about them personally or what is going on in their lives to feel like I know enough to draw a sensible conclusion.
With Rashford he seems like he has a decent moral core based on his efforts to make sure kids didn't go hungry. He used his position of fame to help others and that should be commended, on the most part that has been.
On the pitch he has at times carried us, and has shown genuine world class form at times. Consistency has been a problem, but a fully fit and on form Rashford starts for pretty much every side in the league.
The question is why is he so inconsistent. In the past the excuses of youth and being moved around position have been valid potential reasons.
While he has carried the goalscoring burden for us in the past he isn't the kind of player who can drag his teammates performance up. To be fair very few forwards tend to have that quality. They are goal scorers and by nature that tends to make players selfish and more focused on themselves in their efforts to score. Midfielders and defenders tend to be more team focused and as such there are far more examples of players from those positions who can elevate the performance of those around them.
As such for a player like Rashford his form will be more dependent on that of the team, he needs his teammates to provide him with good quality chances for him to be able to play at his best. So maybe his form and inconsistency can be partially explained by the team's own inconsistent performances.
There have also been rumours and suggestions that his form might be connected to his private life. Again something that shouldn't be too surprising. Most of us will see a downturn in our performance at work when we are dealing with turmoil or difficulties in our private lives. Very few people can block out those troubles while at work, and I think the ones that can tend to be able to do so because their work is an escape. I wonder how that might change if you're work is examined under the microscope of the print and online media. Can work be an escape when you are put under that much pressure.
This brings me to the crux of this whole situation for me. What support should the club offer a player like Rashford and are they giving him that support.
If a player, particularly a current or former academy player has issues in their private life to what extent do the club have a responsibility to support them with that?
We as a club take kids who are not emotionally or mentally mature and start training them to become top players. Part of that process puts them in situations that most teenagers never experience. They are exposed to pressures that many fully mature adults would struggle with, and they are expected to make good decisions and are disproportionately judged when they make mistakes common for most teenagers.
Most of them don't come from homes or backgrounds that have experience or the knowledge of how to support and advise them. They are picked out by agents and hanger-on's looking to make money on the back of these young players talent. People who will use manipulation on these kids to further their own ends.
The club looks to benefit from producing these young players, either making money on the back of selling them on, or by producing a top level player for a fraction of what it would cost to buy a similar player. Academy players on the whole tend to earn less at their clubs than players signed by the club. Their attachment to the club being taken advantage of by the club to have higher quality players on lower wages than they would potentially earn elsewhere.
Which for me personally means that the club does have more responsibility to support it's players, particularly it's academy and former academy players, far more than that of a traditional employer.
The club, while providing these young players with a fantastic opportunity, have exposed these young people to experiences and challenges they are not for the most part equipped to deal with.
Rather than throw a player like Rashford to the dogs, the club should be doing everything they can to support him and help him deal with whatever issues he has and work with him to get him back to his best form.
Maybe they are, I hope they are. Maybe playing most games is part of that support, maybe he needs the distraction of playing to give him a rest bite from whatever is happening off the pitch. Maybe the club is offering the support and the player isn't accepting it. Or maybe they aren't offering any support at all.
The point for me is that I don't know which of the above is happening. Which makes it very hard for me to judge Rashford currently beyond that his form (for whatever reason) isn't good enough and that needs to be addressed. His on pitch body language and his perceived effort is difficult to judge as I don't know why it's changed. As previously he has always been a hard working and committed player.
His body language, the rumours, the speculation, his tweets or response to questions in the press, and everything else is something I find it difficult to judge him on as I'm only seeing less than 10% of what is happening.
Is Rashford's form a problem? Absolutely. How best to fix that? Well without seeing the whole picture it's impossible to say.
9.) 28 Apr 2024 11:08:59
Why not ship out both and completely remove Ole's first choice attacking line from the club in one fell swoop. None of them have lived up to what we had hoped they would be for different reasons.
10.) 28 Apr 2024 22:23:47
Why not bring back Greenwood, since the charges were dropped, he has a child with that girl and also married her?
11.) 29 Apr 2024 04:27:22
Quite simple Trololo. The club doesn't need the circus that will come from bringing him back. They are trying to turn the page and move forwards with positivity, and bringing Greenwood back would not help to deliver that.
12.) 29 Apr 2024 06:25:29
Sell Greenwood to whichever Spanish side want him and use the money to fund a bid for Olise, then move Garnacho back to is favoured position on the left, move Mount up to attacking midfield, Bruno as the box2box midfielder and let Mainoo keep learning the DM role.
With Licha back next season with Shaw we only need a new CB, maybe Braithwaite or the kid from Nice and we are good to go.
Easy being a manger isn't it.
13.) 29 Apr 2024 12:59:13
I understand that Dodgy, the problem is with the fans, who are, imo, hilarious, that is why I posted that.
14.) 29 Apr 2024 13:23:55
She is so lucky eh Trololo?
15.) 29 Apr 2024 14:00:56
Taking Greenwood back is not an option. Rushford is in poor form and clearly struggling with his mentality. Greenwood is a scumbag who doesn't deserve the talent, platform or career ahead of him.
16.) 29 Apr 2024 16:33:14
What is your point patrick?
James, that is only your opinion. If he is or isn't a scumbag should be irrelevant. He wasn't convicted and that should be enough.
17.) 29 Apr 2024 19:23:58
Are you really asking Trololo?
18.) 30 Apr 2024 16:02:20
For some reason, my comment didn't go through.
Anyway, yes, I am really asking.
19.) 30 Apr 2024 17:45:58
Trololo, Domestic violence. Not a good image for the club to be associated with. Most victims stay / withdraw from cases. Does that make him innocent? What about women, both players and fans of Man Utd? Move on from Greenwood.
20.) 04 May 2024 14:22:36
I think there is another angle that is worth looking at.
First of all, if he realLy is innocent as Richard Arnold’s taskforce seems to believe, he should be reinstated.
If not, then him playing for Manchester United is in the best interest of the victim. She would be isolated anywhere else in the world, in Manchester she would have her family around for those tough moments that will surely be coming again sometime in the future.
Just food for thought.
23 Jun 2023 17:49:20
I find it disingenuous to those that suggest the sale of the Club will have no bearing on this summers transfer window.
Had the takeover of the Club been completed in April or May as many commentators had predicated I don't think there is any doubt that this summers transfer window would have looked remarkably different. New owners would be keen to show intent and make an immediate impression.
Whilst it may be true to suggest that the sale of the Club won't necessarily divert from a usual Glazer summer of indecision, delay and protracted negotiations had new owners been in place maybe we could have been spared such frustration and drama.
In relation to this summers transfer window a lack of leadership and indecision reigns again.
Mount may arrive if a fee can be agreed with Chelsea and Rabiot seems a cheaper alternative to the likes of Rice and Caicedo however his wages could still present a problem.
The GK situation is bizarre. Surely if there was uncertainty surrounding De Gea this should have been treated as a priority with many supporters labelling a new keeper as essential summer business. If De Gea leaves then obviously a new GK will arrive, however as it stands the situation remains unclear. Will the club move for a cheaper GK to provide competition for De Gea or someone more established and replace him as No1?! The fact this decision has not yet been made is scary.
A new CB is probably dependant on selling Maguire so I don't expect that to be resolved anytime soon.
With Kane and Osimhen seemingly both unavailable the CF situation is complex. I get the impression the Club are reluctant to splash the cash on a younger, inexperienced prospect just yet. I have a suspicion that some at the Club still believe that Harry Kane may become available later in the window especially if he agitates for a move therefore in my opinion I don't think the CF position will be resolved until the end of the window.
I get the impression there is a lot of indecision within the Club not fully decided if they want to invest heavily in new GK or the what kind of CF they want to move for. Considering many supporters believed both positions were key summer priority's it's alarming that the Club doesn't seem to have a clear and coherent plan.
We could fall lucky like we did last year but if that happens I expect more panic, drama and no doubt a big overspend on someone because they've left it late.
1.) 23 Jun 2023 18:04:18
Clear and coherent plan and Manchester United don’t go together and hasn’t for years. We can only hope that new ownership and a new structure can change that…. if we get new owners that is.
2.) 23 Jun 2023 18:11:51
Good post DLIB. 10Hag must be incredibly frustrated.
3.) 23 Jun 2023 18:55:07
I don't think even this leadership will fail to get an acceptable striker, but we do really need a backup too, unless Rashford is being moved up front full time (which I don't think he should be, at least not now, maybe in the future) .
Well, worst case we can use McT as backup striker, he offers everything Weghorst did, but with more goal threat! (Sadly I'm only half joking here)
4.) 23 Jun 2023 18:56:25
Maybe if the club had been sold by April/ May then things might have been different.
Yet I think its disingenuous to place all blame at the Glazers door for that.
The saying goes it takes two to tango. The fact that we ended up with three rounds of bidding and that the rumoured fee being paid is north of 6bn, up over 3.2bn on anything offered in the first round of bids just shows that this is a process.
Being angry at people for refusing a lower deal when they have gone on to secure a much better one seems daft and pointless.
I think a lot of of fans got a little carried away when the first rumours of the club being potentially up for sale. They let their imagination run away with itself. We'd get a new owner, someone who understands the club, who is a fan, who has a clear plan and will invest. Clear the debt, build a new stadium, build a new training ground, and of course bankroll a luxury summer of expensive signings.
It's best not to look at things in the short term view. We will have new owners and it's probably better for them to really get their feet under the table over the summer and over the course of next season.
The last thing the club needs is kneejerk reactions. Sack this person and that person and try and hire someone to come in and implement a plan that they have literally had to pull out of their derrière with absolutely no understanding of the club. Owners more concerned with making a fancy entrance than making sensible well thought-out moves. Buying big name, fancy players to try and woo the fans.
The signings the club have wanted to make after scouting throughout the season, players who suit the managers profile and fit into his plans.
Having new owners who can have a chance to see what is working and what isn't, while also having the common sense to plan out how and when to make those changes. Is vital.
5.) 23 Jun 2023 20:01:38
Dlib, we have ffp to deal with. Owners can't just come in and spend what they want. Unless we sell some the kitty is looking low.
6.) 23 Jun 2023 22:00:34
FFP is definitely a factor for us, we have to face facts that for now we can’t compete on the mega deal front in respect of transfer fees.
7.) 23 Jun 2023 22:28:09
FiremanC - Not without sales. The issue is we must raise £100m sales to be able to spend say £400m. But we cannot spend £400m without knowing for sure we can raise £100m. And you cannot guarantee you will raise £100m. We don't have a crystal ball. That's why we cannot rush into buying everyone. It was always going to be about outgoings, I'm not convinced we will do anything different than other seasons, therefore it'll be tough this summer. We have already priced Fred out of a Fulham move. He's 30. We need to be more flexible with sales and not penny pinch so much. We will miss out on EtH's targets. That's why for me it was super important that we were taken over by the Qataris asap, as they would allow for small loses on outgoing players to allow them to move on. IE freeing up money for the benefit of FFP. I have no faith in the current team to get players out the door.
8.) 23 Jun 2023 23:20:52
According to the Athletic we do not have particularly pressing FFP concerns. I think the existing combined debt of £1.1bn is more problematic. We don't have the cash on hand to make any big up front cash purchases.
21 Jul 2020 08:15:50
There has been some fierce debate since the Chelsea defeat but maybe some perspective is needed.
Only a couple of weeks ago Chelsea lost to West Ham and Sheffield Utd and looked anything like convincing in a narrow victory over Crystal Palace. They have their own problems in defence and with another Spanish goalkeeper coincidentally so they have not suddenly become world beaters again overnight.
Utd now need to show some resilience and mental strength. We look a team showing signs of fatigue and some parallels can be drawn to last season when Ole went on a magnificent run only for it to fall apart once we'd dragged ourselves back into contention. The same excuses were rolled out then. Injury and fatigue bore the blame but this time history cannot repeat itself.
We need to exhibit a steely reserve, to win our next two fixtures and complete a remarkable turn around. There will be no trophy or even celebration for finishing 4th. It will still represent a poor season where we have finished over 30 points behind the leaders but maybe the seeds of recovery have been sown over the last few weeks. A return to Europe's elite competition will see us welcome Europe's best back to Old Trafford and hopefully the extra revenue generated will be reinvested back into the playing squad.
As for next season expectations should be tempered. Any talk of a title challenge is dangerously premature and once again we'll be in a fight for a top 4 finish with the likes of Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal, Leicester, Wolves etc
Progress has been made, the team is now capable of scoring more goals, is becoming more consistent, whilst the style and brand of football is slowly evolving. I think we've been treated to some fantastic, attacking football since the re start, scoring some memorable goals and perhaps we have seen the birth of our next academy superstar.
We've seen ourselves the difference that just one player can make to a team so with the right recruitment we do have cause for optimism. The prospect of seeing Rashford, Martial, Fernandes and Sancho not matter how unlikely is exciting and with Greenwood continuing to develop we have a core of good players capable of competing with the best.
We must now finish the job and look forwards not back. The Chelsea defeat is consigned to history and in some ways we have bigger business to take care of. It's a big week ahead for Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and the direction of his Man Utd team.
1.) 21 Jul 2020 10:27:48
Dlib
Nice to see there are still some people on the site with a modicum of common sense and knowledge. ðŸ‘ðŸ‘.
2.) 21 Jul 2020 10:28:57
Sensible post. I think the issue is most of us have become entrenched in our views either pro or against the manager. Them the most recent results become the basis of either proving your opinion right or wrong.
The reality is the unless Ole massively improves them he isn't the right long term manager for us. Yet in the short term he has shipped out the right players, brought in players with the right mentality, he has given youth a chance, improved most players in the squad and given the club back some of its identity. As a result whoever takes over will take over a club and a side in much better shape than it was when Ole took over.
Whether this summer, next summer or beyond is the right time to replace Ole remains to be seen and until he is will remain a hypothetical opinion only.
My view is we have a young side that is benefitting from having a manger who trusts them, regardless of who we sign we are too far off of Liverpool and City who have sides at their peak currently to realistically catch them next season.
They say a squad peaks with an average age between 26-29. That is where Liverpool and City are now. Our average age is 23/ 24 so we need more experience before we hit our peak.
For me next season would be a success if we are comfortably 3rd with a much smaller gap between us and 1st, anything below a 10 point gap would be a great improvement. I think we need to win a cup either the Europa League this season or a cup next season. Winning breeds a winning mentality and with so many young players in the squad winning a cup would be a huge growth experience for them.
Onwards and upwards. We need to refocus on the next game, forget Leicester. Win at West Ham, and try and win by a good margin. That would show a good bounce back mentality and would go some way to maintaining confidence levels. While also putting us in the best possible place ahead of the final day showdown.
3.) 21 Jul 2020 10:58:29
Agreed. If Ole can get us back into the top 4, playing some good football, maybe Europa League as a bonus, you have to after he’s done a sterling job and deserves another transfer window to continue his project. The atmosphere around our club is chalk and cheese to Jose’s reign. I for one am not complaining - yes he makes a few mistakes, but he’s learning all the time.
4.) 21 Jul 2020 11:20:01
Top post DLIB.
5.) 21 Jul 2020 12:07:37
Top post and well said DLIB.
6.) 21 Jul 2020 12:52:37
Good post dlib. City have lost a host of league games this year and are 20 points worse off than last year and have just been outplayed by arsenal. Do we see mass hysteria? Sack pep? players not good enough? No we don't. If I had said after the Burnley defeat that with 2 league games to go CL qualification would be in our hands I would have been laughed off this site. We are looking a little fatigued which is why the team and the manager need all our support not relentless criticism for losing a game which wasn't in the grand scheme of things particularly important.
7.) 21 Jul 2020 13:31:30
our inability to finish teams off is one of the issues we had early in the season which has cost us points.
we have drew 11 games.
lost the 2nd least amount of games and have conceded the joint second least.
i think with a few more players, especially a right winger, and another central midfielder regardless if pogba stays or not you will see a difference.
8.) 21 Jul 2020 14:02:34
Good post DLIB.
But I remain unconvinced that Ole has what it takes to take us forward next season and beyond. Still too many question marks hang over him and what he has achieved so far. I do hope I am wrong.
DLIB's banter posts with other poster's replies to DLIB's banter posts
09 May 2024 15:41:42
I posted about culture the other day and I honestly believe that has been the biggest contributor to poor performance over the past 10 years.
Since SAF retired the Club has been shambles devoid of any identity, leadership or purpose.
The culture is set at the top and filters down. Recruitment has been a disgrace, managers have been undermined and player power has prospered.
We only have to caste our minds back a couple of years to when Ralph Rangnick was appointed interim manager. His appointment was lauded by many supporters and received with great positivity and optimism, not necessarily because of his coaching ability but more looking forward to his role as advisor.
I clearly remember the first 45 minutes of his reign against Crystal Palace. The pressing, the aggression, the work rate was fantastic and the football was refreshing. Sadly we only experienced this for 45 minutes. He later honestly informed us that the players could not sustain this type of football and he recommended open heart surgery. The rest is history.
Ole was often disrespectfully labelled a PE teacher, criticised for a lack of identity and tactical nous, but If you listened carefully, Ole often expressed in many of his interviews how he wanted his team to be proactive, press from the front and play attacking adventurous football. He got stuck playing counter attacking football to appease the players, that couldn't play with the required intensity or consistency.
Whatever you think of EtH he has attempted to change the style of play and if you agree with it or not there is an argument he has been let down by the Club.
He has not been allowed to remove players and the Club have missed out on several of his first choice players.
How a Club lurches from FdJ to Casemiro only highlights the problems in recruitment.
Whatever you feel about Maguire and Mctominay EtH wanted to remove them both in the summer.
They both refused transfers and the Club had no appetite to move them on.
I think we can all agree, whether you like them both or not, neither are particularly suited to a team that wants to play a high line, press from the front, rotate the ball and retain possession. How can a team progress when the manager is forced to regularly rely on players he knows are not suited to his system?
EtH arrived at the Club with a rotten culture, with incompetent decision makers, useless negotiations, complicated further with the owners putting the Club up for sale.
I don't know if EtH should keep his job, but I believe there is certainly enough mitigation to suggest this is not an easy or straightforward decision.
My hope is that with a footballing structure in place subsequent managers will be better supported and more scrutiny placed on the players to perform consistently otherwise they will be removed from the Club as well as the manager.
1.) 09 May 2024 16:36:57
Really good post DLIB, encapsulates my thoughts perfectly.
2.) 09 May 2024 18:44:29
I agree with a fair part of that Dlibhere is where we differ in our opinions the most I think.
For me it all comes down to coaching and what's happening on the pitch and training ground.
Technically our players are miles behind the competition.
Physically we are miles behind the competition.
Team shape and having a solid formation and plan we are miles behind the competition.
It does not take 2 years to get players fit. When cas came he was a beast king of the gym ahead of ronaldo.
I can't think of one player that has improved under eth in 2 years in all 3 of those aspects and in the vast majority of cases in any of the 3.
Stylistically casimero and fdj are polls apart 100% agree.
He came into a mess and did well last year but not one single player has improved many have got worse.
Injuries explain some results but it doesn't stop those playing being able to do the basics of control pass move and shape.
Repetition Repetition Repetition that's coaching.
Drill after drill everybody knows the job and can do the basics.
You need your best players to make it sing we all accept that.
Either eth can't get his message across or he can't accept his message is wrong.
Look at the job the new Palace and Bournemouth coaches for example have done.
Palace players double sessions for 6 weeks and are covering more ground are quicker and in tune with their jobs.
Bournemouth have not a squad close to ours yet all their players are improving individually and collectively.
Forget the structure above him forget the past and point out which players eth has improved.
At the end of 2 years what do we see footprint wise of coaching on the pitch.
Leaving aside his ridiculous media statements of
This calendar year we have been OK only losing 4 times
And
We are one of the most entertaining and dynamic teams in the country.
Leaving aside his handling of sancho and ronaldo neither of which reflect well on him notwithstanding both players being way out of line.
Leaving aside all the minus goal difference 8th place, humiliating cl performance.
All that ignored our players are not improving technically physically or tactically after 2 years of his coaching.
Garnacho is to me looking less dangerous by the week. If he has garnacho long enough he will turn him into another Anthony who eth has said is unplayable at times.
Nothing has improved on the pitch it's got worse the longer he is with them.
3.) 09 May 2024 19:44:33
I must admit I’m on the fence with eth though what if the players do not have the right attitude and application in training to want to improve. Like dlib says eth may be trying his best but his hands are tied because of the clubs inept ability to get certain players out and the ones in the manager actually wants.
We are Manchester United and we scramble around for frees or loan deals what other top clubs do that.
4.) 09 May 2024 19:46:38
Tumble - I fully accept your argument and I can understand your point of view I just think we’ve heard the same argument from a number of different coaches now. None of them have succeeded in implementing a decent style of football and none of them have been able to make them press. To be fair I think we’ve said the same about each manager. We’ve all called them tactical inept and questioned which players they’ve improved?
I accept it’s complicated and I’m certainly not absolving EtH of any responsibility.
My hope is under a new structure and recruitment team there will be a more detailed, methodical and analytical approach to transfers where players are recruited according to how the team wants to play. Hopefully players will no longer be rewarded with lucrative long term contracts, just to protect their value, when in reality this actually makes them unsellable, meaning we’re stuck with unsuitable players for long periods that we can’t get rid of.
I’m cautiously optimistic and have no choice but to trust the new regime to make better decisions. Things can often look bleak but recruit a few good players and things can change pretty quickly in football. Personally I’d stick with the manager but understand those that want a change.
5.) 09 May 2024 21:24:41
I don't think things look bleak. I think there is a better outlook than we have had for years. Opportunity knocks imo.
6.) 10 May 2024 10:35:18
Two excellent posts there DLIB.
7.) 10 May 2024 14:02:11
What would SAF have done qith this team. I imagine half 9f them would never wear the shirt again and would be shipped out quicker than their feet could touch the ground. This is something that the majority of managers have wanted to do to a lot of players but for some reason the people in charge just aren't listening.
Sooner or later we need to stick with a manager and actually let them do their job.
26 Apr 2024 19:37:50
With EtH seemingly teetering on the brink and fan opinion slowing beginning to change I think it's only fair we examine what do we want from a Man Utd manager?
If you rewind 2 years EtH arrived to much fanfare. He was the overwhelming choice for the majority of this fan base. He played some fantastic football with a young and vibrant Ajax team. He was innovative and tactically astute. He'd presided over some great results and performances particularly in the Champions League against European giants. He'd lost key players but managed to re build the team and remain successful. He gave opportunities to young players.
Some may argue he wasn't in change of recruitment at Ajax and he's made some big mistakes in that department during his time at Utd but is that not on the Club? We have been making mistakes in the transfer market long before EtH arrived.
If memory serves me right, I think he was interviewed for the Spurs job and they raised some concerns about his charisma and personality. I don't think most fans were particularly concerned by this, especially considering Spurs track record in appointing new managers!
EtH was the fans choice, he had the overwhelming support of the vast majority of the fan base and I think it's so disappointing to see him in trouble.
I accept there has been mistakes and those that want him out do make some valid arguments, which must be carefully considered!
My question is if EtH is sacked, what characteristics are we looking for in the new manager? What do we actually want? What are we looking for?
1.) 26 Apr 2024 21:05:03
Anyone who isn't Southgate.
2.) 26 Apr 2024 21:10:57
Tbh, I think the question is difficult to answer without first addressing the more pressing issue of what overarching direction the club should take?
I am pleased that the club seems to be more focused on appointing a directorate, rather than addressing the coaching situation. Because it’s impossible to pick a coach without first deciding how to rebuild the club structures and develop a long term strategy. For instance, City put structures in place for recruitment, the academy, the facilities, etc before bringing in the right manager. Or Chelsea have decided upon a strategy of investing in young players and giving them time to develop.
Until all the people are in place to decide upon United’s strategy, hiring a new manager is kind of pointless. For example, the club could hire Southgate, his primary experience is in international football, and main strength seems to be in creating a solid squad identity and positive atmosphere. Is this what the club needs going forward? We have no way of knowing because the key people haven’t been able to get in the same room and discuss it. Zidane, did relatively well managing big egos at a big club. Is this what the club needs to rebuild? No idea. We don’t know the recruitment strategy.
Personally I thought ETH was the right choice at the time, as the players seemed to be running the show and deciding if and when they turned up. But without competent people above him, ETH has failed in recruitment and, rather than creating squad discipline, his authoritative approach has incrementally alienated him.
My only answer at this point is that appointing a new manager carries a high risk of repeating past mistakes. Is it better to stick with a failing manager and give the new directorate time to develop the right strategy, or roll the dice and hope to develop the strategy in tandem with a new manager who could galvanise the squad? For me, the smart approach is to take the time to do things right. We’ve been a club in steady decline since before Fergie retired, and another year of mediocrity isn’t such a big deal if it results in a proper rebuild led by experienced professionals and not a bunch of cowboys.
3.) 26 Apr 2024 21:19:43
Sjr and the new team will decide that it doesn't really matter what we want.
There is no magic wand but personally I would like to see continuous improvement over the next 2 / 3 years.
The question is very simple
It's not a question of has eth done a good job or bad job it's not a question of is he a failure.
The question is, is he the man that they see bringing us to the next level?
The fans have no choice on who should succeed him.
No point referencing the past decisions they were made by non appropriate people for lady 12 years. They are not in charge anymore.
This team did not appoint eth they probably never would have.
4.) 26 Apr 2024 22:02:50
I agree Danny.
5.) 26 Apr 2024 22:41:24
Great post Danny. Couldn’t agree more actually. One of the main reasons I back ETH is because I feel if he’s sacked, it’s another win for some of the players, who are influential due to personality and longevity. Said before, some players, I think, know they can outlast manager which is not great. If ineos can help change this mentality, be it with or without ETH, then the club can start to move forward. Manager needs to be backed over the players, whoever it may be. I hope it’s ETH but I’ll back the next manager over players everyday. Unless it’s Southgate ?.
6.) 26 Apr 2024 23:11:43
A new manger with the same squad or cosmetic changes will not change anything imo. We have been at this for so long now and the candidates being discussed will do worse as many much better managers have failed if we don't fix the underlying issues.
only a few months to go before we get a sense of if we are really turning the corner or much of the same. The only saving grace is our academy seems to be in a great place atm and some really interesting players coming through.
7.) 27 Apr 2024 08:05:48
I just read an article with the pass maps of several Midfielders in recent games. What was stark, really stark was that the ball was almost never passed forward, almost always sideways or backwards and almost no direct forward passes. I have commented on the pass inside keep ball tactics but the pass map shows it clearly. We need a more progressive manager, one who will coach defenders to defend but have a style going forward, patterns of play and play forward. We also do not cross the ball, yet when you watch the top teams, they do. Antony against Sheffield never tried to get past his full back, just turned back and inside, against the bottom team, that has to be instructed tactics.
The key basis of hiring a new manager would be to coach a more coordinated attacking style, looking forward and not back and across, not playing keep ball for the sake of it. The new management must set that style as the basis of the requirement for a coach. ETH has had a chance to implement it, but even up to recent games it suggests he can’t or won’t do anything different. Why should we expect a change from him when other players come in.
We should want a coach who coaches a more coordinated approach, looking forward with passes, use our width and get crosses in to the right areas, defenders in the right positions. ETH has either deliberately not done it or can’t do it, but it is what we need to see in our coach. My bet is the senior management will and should appoint on that basis and it’s we we all should want.
8.) 27 Apr 2024 13:42:09
If ETH suits the new management’s style of play and tactics, then they’ll stick with him. I think any of us would be delighted to see a Utd side doing well and playing the marvellous football his Ajax side did.
Personally, I’m still in the stick camp (just) .
9.) 27 Apr 2024 20:18:06
I'm only in the stick camp still because I cannot see any obvious replacements.
EtH built this team, they are mostly players he has bought or promoted from the academy, if he cannot get them working as a team rather than a bunch of individuals that is a huge concern.
06 Apr 2024 07:39:07
{Ed's Note - DLIB has posted a new article entitled, Cool heads must prevail at Manchester United
1.) 06 Apr 2024 08:48:52
Excellent post DLIB. Agree, including the part regarding Rashford. In answer to question, "How do you solve a problem called Marcus Rashford? " Getting rid is the only option in my view. He is infecting the squad with his attitude and letting the team down with his lack of effort.
2.) 06 Apr 2024 09:04:54
Yeah, the only way for Rashford is out. There's no place for him at Utd. He's the worst kind of footballer and quite rightly the fans can't stand him.
The problem is on £375k a week the only place he could feasibly go is PSG.
If it was up to me I'd have him working in the car park.
3.) 06 Apr 2024 09:16:36
good article DLIB-
what I would say that hasn't been considered as much, is not a question of getting rid of eth, but what if he simply engineers a move or resigns his post? After all he hasn't had an easy ride during his tenure and with more than a year of uncertainty re buyout and the player issues ronaldo, sancho and rashford as well as a lot of stuff we don't fully know; he might just take time out .
Regarding rashford, this isn't his only season of mediocrity and apart from last year hasn't been the superstar since C.V. hit. last season he had a purple patch in the league 27/ 12 until the game before 7-0 to them. after that 3 in 12 games and 4 before his run . 17 league goals is not a world class return ;new challenge for him and fee and wage saving would be the best thing.
4.) 06 Apr 2024 10:20:35
Funky pigeon, as Laurie Whitwell has said, ajaz, Bayern and Barcelona will all consider him. Seen as overachieving at United given the tools at this disposal.
I really hope they stick with him.
5.) 06 Apr 2024 17:09:19
angel must admit I am leaning more towards him staying as I think he has had some crap to wade through :at least for another season but can see why the clubs you mention could consider him- after the other results today hope he conjers something up tomorrow as well as the team:)
6.) 06 Apr 2024 18:25:57
Some crap is an understatement.
We those clubs must know something about him ?
But I'm glad to read Whitwells article about the planning for next year.
I think, also, ETH is some what lucky that Ashworth and Berrada are not technically in place yet.
7.) 06 Apr 2024 19:24:13
Angel, genuine question here.
Have you watched the football on offer this season? If so what from it has made you think this manager deserves another £2/ 300 million to spend?
If this is question was 12 months ago I’d have said back him, after what I’ve saw this season, no chance.
8.) 06 Apr 2024 20:17:43
Yes I've watched Caolan, I see a team that hasn't the players capable of playing the football that ETH requires.
I used this analogy some days ago. A man has married 5 times, each time divorcing the wife. At what point does the husband look at himself and see that he is the problem.
We have had Moyes, LVG, Jose, Rangnick and ETH. Managers that have forgotten more about football than we will ever know. Each time, the same thing has happened, they have all been sacked without any deep dive into the club structure or why so many knowledgeable managers have gone and gone.
Now we have a manager that has achieved, 3rd place, and 2 cup finals (hopefully 3) in two seasons against a myriad of issues both on and off the field. Did he overachieve, is he underachieving?
Whether he is the right or wrong man for the future, he deserves the opportunity to work within a structure that should give him the platform to succeed. If, next season, more of the same issues on the field are taking place, I will be the first one to say thank and time to move on. But right now, there is so much uncertainty of what can be achieved with this man and I don't believe it's the right time to call it a day with him. Plus, Southgate or Potter, really? Because that's what we will get.
I also look to Arteta as a great example of what can happen when you back a manager and give him the time. 8th, 8th, 5th, losing 36 league games in the process. 90% of Arsenal fans wanted him gone, but the board and the powers that be believed, and trusted him. I think Erik has also earned that right. Let's get behind him, for now.
9.) 06 Apr 2024 20:34:36
I am not really so bothered with tha manager position as I am who we appoint in the DoF position.
If the route we are going is to put someone in total charge this has to be the right person and they need to get the right people in for their plan.
10.) 06 Apr 2024 23:08:41
Sorry but I’m sick of seeing this rubbish that we don’t have the players to play his style. What is his style? Last season was pragmatic, and much much better than the dross we have seen this season. We played with much more control at times and were far more secure defensively.
Now it’s all changed and the style of play has completely flipped. Did we chase Frenkie De Jong to try and play this style we have seen this season? The answer is no. Again, I’ve saw zero from him this season to suggest he deserves to be in the job. We are lucky to be in 6th and I would suggest we will be lucky to finish in Europe if we continue playing this absolutely ludicrous football.
Who does ten hag need to be able to play the system we’ve employed all season? What midfielders out there can cover 60m of space running a bleep test all game? I’ve nothing personal against ten hag, but after what was a promising first season, we’ve totally regressed and I don't think he has a clue how to fix the consistent problems we have seen in nearly every single match this season. Mainly, cut back goals and leaving huge spaces in midfield due to whatever the bloody pressing system is.
Also, the night before a Liverpool match you don’t want the managers mouthpiece (mullock from the daily mail) putting out he feels he has no support from the new regime either. Not much of a look imo.
11.) 07 Apr 2024 01:36:43
Caolan, you not been watching the games to know what he wants to do and realize that we really don't have the players in the right positions?
Near on 60 injuries too, I mean come on, what's supposed to be done?
Do you think Arsenal did the right thing in giving Arteta time, even though he lost 36 league games in 3 years?
If you can't see why he should be given the chance to stay after the last 2 years, then there's no convincing you.
Keep wishing for him to get sacked, because we will end up with Potter or Southgate. ETH will move and be a success elsewhere whilst we will be wondering how we ended up with Southgate.
12.) 07 Apr 2024 03:08:11
I’m going to put it out there that ETH will be a middle of the road manager and never really a huge success to the level of Fergie, Wenger, Klopp, Pep, Jose et al.
13.) 07 Apr 2024 09:39:31
Keefy, how many managers in the world have reached those levels?
14.) 07 Apr 2024 09:41:09
angel
You are saying we don’t have the players in the right positions. It is well reported that ETH was contractually given significant say over who was bought and loaned in. Was it £400m spent, loans on top and you say we still don’t have players in the right positions? Why. ETH must take significant blame for that. Why do we have no left back? Why only one functioning CF? Why does Rashford play? When we all knew what we needed, why buy Mount for Bruno’s position? Why Onana? Why Amrabat? Why players ETH had a connection with? There are many more questions, but we needed to see a coordinated coached team and haven’t seen anything that resembles coaching. The continued selection of Rashford, the damage that did to the team on Thursday is baffling. Said many times ETH needed to show coaching and leadership and hasn’t.
As to Potter and Southgate, I would despair at Southgate as I did with Moyes and Ole. Potter has potential in the right circumstances. I would rather have ETH for another season than Southgate. It’s a pity we can’t get Pep from City when his contract runs out, if the owners want the best, that’s what they should do. But Southgate would make me doubt the part owners immediately.
Let’s hope today is not painful, because the pressure will ramp if it is.
15.) 07 Apr 2024 10:11:28
Angel……agreed, not many.
But it was more a point that ETH is sadly never, in my very humble opinion, going to be at the level required by UTD and will go on to be an average manager.
I had hoped that he would prevail but he is way out of his depth at this level.
16.) 07 Apr 2024 11:39:02
I’d call it a day on Rashford too. He just needs a change, and his attitude doesn’t correlate with his ability/ consistency (in a good way that is) on the pitch.
Martial, Rashford, Varane, Cas, Maguire, Lindleof, AWB, Donny, Pellestri and Sancho all need to leave as a good start, and replace them with the right profile of player and personality in the summer from the transfer market and academy if suitable. I know that is a lot of change, but it’s time to rip the band aid off and do that open heart surgery we’ve been talking a lot about.
17.) 07 Apr 2024 18:25:40
It’s not wishing him sacked, because it means we are doing poorly.
But I have seen zero in his performances this season as manager to warrant more time. If he doesn’t have the players available like you keep saying, perhaps he should’ve pushed for players to do so. Or perhaps he should find a way to play with the players at his disposal.
Yet again today, we should’ve conceded 5/ 6.
05 Apr 2024 22:00:08
DLIB has written a new article entitled, Cool heads must prevail at Manchester United
1.) 06 Apr 2024 00:31:05
Great read that DLIB
You are bang on, as much as I think ETH may not be the right man it would be foolish to make any sort of decision until CEO, DOF and TD are all in place as it is there job to come up with the right replacement.
02 Apr 2024 07:39:07
{Ed's Note - DLIB has posted a new article entitled, Sacking Erik ten Hag from Manchester United is not the answer
1.) 02 Apr 2024 09:35:38
How many times has he said in his interviews after a loss that 'the other team wanted it more'? If that's the case on so many occasions then he is not doing his job! Either he instills that eagerness in them or plays those who want it that much.
2.) 02 Apr 2024 14:49:18
Onana intl player
Lindelof intl captain
Maguire intl player
Varane retired won the lot
Dalot intl player
Cas intl captain
Mainoo intl player
Mctom intl player
Rash intl player
Bruno intl captain
Garnacho intl player
Rasmus intl player
Let me stress none of these are any good and it's nothing to do with their club manager that they are playing awful for their club.
Nothing to do with his set up or tactics. He motivates the players brilliantly it's not his fault we have list 33% of our league games
It's not his fault that we have a negative league goal difference since he came to the club (perhaps +3 over nearly 2 seasons) .
Nothing g to do with him that we finished bottom of our cl group for the 1st time ever.
Not his fault we won't make top 5 for cl next season
Not his fault for anything negative.
Eth needs more time to get us into the bottom half of the league. He needs more time to turn garnacho into Anthony. He needs more time to sign more duds.
He just needs time.
3.) 02 Apr 2024 15:36:06
Lolll Kennn you seriously don't like ETH and we get that and I was like that with ole but this guy ETH needs timee with quality players he didn't get his first choice players so he is struggling right now and the injuries hasn't helped either.
4.) 02 Apr 2024 15:36:56
Anyways being a internwtional player means nothing lolll. Even Kalvin Phillips plays for England sometimes and that says it all.
5.) 02 Apr 2024 16:30:00
I actually don't dislike him. Nor do I think he has failed in a lot respects. I just don't think he has shown any more than Ron Atkinson dave sexton ole or even Jose.
Do I think under eth we will continue to win the odd cup and have some good moments every season yes I do think that's exactly what we would see.
I don't see any hope of us getting much closer to the dominant teams consistently under him, no matter what the curmudgeon above him or playerwise that's the reason I want to change now.
I see traits in him that I don't like or identify with I don't see them aligning with the club and too many players, current or new.
If there were more green shoots I would be delighted but I don't see any reason at all to give him more time I honestly can't think of 1 redeeming feature of this team 2 years into his leadership.
In my opinion he lacks charisma and does little to endear himself to anybody externally and according to apparently is a difficult man to get along with and work with.
I agree Singh being an intl player doesn't guarantee that you are great but more often than not it means you are not useless.
Philips showed enough for city to buy him. A few on here would have wanted him. Its not easy to adapt to peps game I'm sure, but he will do better next season wherever he goes, decent player in the right set up.
6.) 02 Apr 2024 16:47:06
Ken Klopps gone and guardiola won't be here long. I am sure Eth cn deal with arteta and Totts manager as they r the next best and I think Eth cn beat those two teams.
7.) 02 Apr 2024 17:30:08
Its the measure now, being an international player. That's it, rest your case Ken ?
What was it Keane said to Jamie Redknapp about getting an international cap.
"Playing for your country doesn’t make you a good player. If you can trap a ball you can play for your country these days. It doesn’t make you a top player. " ? ? ?.
8.) 02 Apr 2024 17:32:44
Singh - what a ridiculios thing to say!
We are currrently clinging on to 6th position with a zero goal difference.
We are nowhere near City, Liverpool and Arsenal and you can add Villa to that at the moment.
Barry Fry could manage those 4 teams and still finish miles ahead of United.
It's a shambles, we are a laughing stocck, the butt of everyones jokes.
It's embarrassing toi watch now.
9.) 02 Apr 2024 19:56:42
Angel what's keano shouting there in your avatar?
TIME ????.
10.) 03 Apr 2024 06:54:32
Ah the arguments are getting weaker Mr. Tumble ? ?.
11.) 03 Apr 2024 10:56:06
We'll see angel we'll see.
12 Jun 2024 10:01:51
Good post Wazza.
29 May 2024 09:11:14
Good post Shaw llets see what happens in the coming days.
28 May 2024 14:57:55
Who’s conducting this review?
The new CEO doesn’t start until July and Dan Ashworth was last seen potting his geraniums?!
Jason Wilcox only started two weeks ago?
If they sack EtH before either are in post who has made this decision?
The cyclist enthusiast, the petrol chemical billionaire or Joel Glazer maybe?
28 May 2024 14:48:42
Excellent post Shaw.
26 Apr 2024 20:38:07
My apologies thanks for your reply.
09 Jun 2024 22:43:53
And I’ll add another thing, hundreds of staff facing redundancy for alleged efficiency savings, all whilst the Glazers fly in on a private jet for the Fa Cup final and stay in the finest hotels, as the Club foots the bill!
How many people have to lose their job, just to cover the cost of the Glazers jetting in for the Cup final?
Is this really what our beloved Club has been become?
Are we really supposed to believe that making people redundant, in order to save money has been the problem and is suddenly going to transform the Club or make any kind of meaningful impact on performance or allow us to compete in the transfer market? That making the poorest people at the Club redundant is the answer and one of the first acts of the new minority owners in supposedly returning us to the top!
The treatment of staff is deplorable, the treatment of EtH completely disrespectful, beware the wolf in sheep’s clothing.
09 Jun 2024 22:17:20
I was under the impression a technical director had been appointed to oversee the strategic direction of the Club, to define the style of play and recruit accordingly.
That being said how does Gareth Southgate, Thomas Tuchel and Roberto De Zerbi all end up on the same list?
Completely different managers with completely ideas, principles and styles of play!
Incompetence personified, Ineos are a shambles and to be openly speaking to multiple other managers, having just won an Fa Cup, when the vast majority of the fan base still support the current manager and he hasn’t even been sacked yet, over two weeks later is an utter disgrace!
EtH outers complaining about the style of play and the Ineos are seriously considering appointing Gareth Southgate is perhaps the biggest irony of them all! incredible, absolutely incredible!
29 May 2024 11:20:21
SRJ, SDB, Wilcox, Blanc and the Glazers.
The others haven’t started yet, unless they’re conspiring away on their encrypted devises!
Judging by Dan Ashworth’s track record let’s pray his football acumen is better than his spy craft otherwise we could end up with Braithwaite rather than Branthwaite!
28 May 2024 10:00:04
Well said DB.
24 May 2024 19:07:11
Ineos incompetence right out of the Glazer playbook. Just business as usual at Man Utd!