20 Dec 2021 09:41:57
Eds Note - Post from Shappy is now on our Football News and Views Articles site - entitled Should Manchester United only scout Players at Clubs with a similar style of play?
20 Dec 2021 11:15:37
Great Post there Shappy, and a nice little observation re Klopps Dortmund team where the sum is greater than its parts and other teams thinking they can nick a little of the magic. Similar to Cloughs teams of the 80's and our own experience with Birtles, Davenport and Webb (Jesus, Neil Webb! ) .
20 Dec 2021 12:26:37
Thanks Stan. I think as a club and a fab base we get too easily side tracked by the big name player, or standout stats.
I remember when we bought Mkhitaryan (from Dortmund incidentally), he had just been named Bundesliga player of the season, got the most assists etc.
Yet outside of Dortmund's system and style of play he struggled with us, and with Arsenal, while being decent at Roma but never recapturing anything like the form he had at Dortmund.
If a player plays in a set up that suits them and even elevates their performances then they will obviously look great.
It's like looking at the number of defensive actions a defender might make as a way to judge a defender.
Yet the context of the side they play in will obviously hugely impact a players individual numbers. If they play in a high pressing or possession dominant team then it's likely that they will either rarely be called into action or that most of the defensive work such as tackles happens much higher up the pitch by other players. Likewise a team that sits deep and invites pressure on to then launch counter attacks will likely see a much higher defensive workload placed on the defenders thus they will naturally make more tackles etc.
Same thing at the other end for goals and assists. If a player takes penalties, or set pieces they will naturally gain more goals/ assists than their teammates. Liverpool for example see their fullbacks get high numbers of assists. Yet both Robertson and TAA both take free-kicks and corners from which they often gain several more goals and assists compared to other full backs who don't take set pieces. It should also be noted Liverpool's style of play places a large creative burden on the full backs which also contributes to their creative numbers.
It's why comparing two players who play in the same position for totally different sides who play very different styles of play isn't the best comparison.
If AWB isn't asked to get forward and attack, and he isn't given the same creative responsibility, or allowed to take set pieces like TAA is then there is little to be gained from comparing the two, even though technically they both play the same position, as what is asked/ expected from them is totally different.
20 Dec 2021 13:42:54
A lot is made of Declan Rice, but I just can't say whether he would be suited to how we are looking to play under Rangnick.
If the intention is to continue to play a similar style after Rangnick steps away from the managers position then surely we need players who suit that.
I wouldn't be surprised if Rice was able to adapt to that style, but he certainly hasn't shown himself to be able to play that way so far in his career. So it would be somewhat of a gamble.
I wonder whether any of Boubacar Kamara, Franck Kessie or Denis Zakaria might be better suited to how Rangnick wants to play. All three are also available on free transfers in the summer. Not that the money should be the deciding factor, but how well they are suited to what Rangnick wants.
20 Dec 2021 17:49:21
Shappy. Am a zn admirer of your observations. Ot telly is a decades old thing now, isn't it. A player is outstanding in a team that plays X way. Let's just shoe horn him in axway that's Y. Mikateryan (spelling) a classic example. Not forgetting the coach (Klopp), he would have you and me running through walls. Has Cloughs Forest all over it.
20 Dec 2021 19:06:08
Excellent post EnglishStan!
20 Dec 2021 19:06:08
Excellent post EnglishStan!