Manchester United banter 84723

 

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11 Feb 2020 13:24:50
On the Pogba situation, he's been an unmitigated disaster, we will do well to get our money back.
He's nowhere as good as some pundits say he is, As the saying goes Good Players can play anywhere, he certainly can't claim that, once he's out the door you will get all the stories about what happened, it was the style of play the tactics did not suit me blah, blah, blah.

Agree3 Disagree0

11 Feb 2020 14:03:01
Alot of the pundits who are currently making excuses for him, blaming the club etc are the same ones who used to lambast his performances on the pitch and call him lazy/ overrated.

Most of the so called tv 'experts' just want to twist the knife into the club with the position its now in, so I wouldn't pay much attention to them. Personally i'd share the blame around but at this point I know longer care, he needs to go as its the best scenario for all concerned.

11 Feb 2020 14:28:43
Pogba is wasted talent that’s for sure. A player that expects others to do the hard work so he can do the highlights stuff. Shame because he has everything, talent wise, to be a complete modern midfielder, the attitude and application will always let him down.

But he isn’t wrong when he says the club made false promises about their ambition when. He was told the club would be challenging for league and champions league titles, but they didn’t back this up with investment. This week the club is still talking about these things as a future aspiration without an evidence that they’re getting closer to making it a reality.

11 Feb 2020 14:54:54
Pogba needs to go for both his and our future. Hugely talented but seems to either lack the motivation or the ability to understand why he isn't achieving what he is capable of. You also need to ask is his inner circle challenging him to be better or enabling him to coast. Either way he needs to move on now and hopefully we can bring in a player with the right attitude to maximise their talent.

Danny, personally I find the investment or lack of it to be a totally mute point. As a club we have now spent 1bn in transfer fees since Sir Alex retired, we also have the second highest wage bill in world football. Plus that doesn't take into account the huge agents fees we have paid to people like Mino Raiola for players like Pogba, Romero, Lukaku, Mkhitryan and Zlatan. Nor what we have paid others.

When it is all considered transfer fees, agents fees and wages there isn't another club in world football who have invested in their playing staff more than us in the time since Sir Alex retired.

We aren't in this mess because the club doesn't spend. We are in it due to the scatter gun approach to spending and the poor squad planning that includes giving contract extensions to players like Phil Jones and Marcos Rojo.

With what we have spent we could have a better first 11 than BOTH City and Liverpool. I don't think its a lack of ambition, if you lack ambition then you only spend what is needed. The fact that we are the biggest spenders world wide suggests the club has ambitions to be a top club. The issue is they don't have the right people behind the scenes to actualise that ambition.

Look at what someone like Ralf Rangnick and others have built with Red bull Leipzig on less than a quarter of the budget in around the same period of time. They have taken a second division side and are genuine contenders to knock Bayern Munich off their perch.

It's not money, its know how we are missing.

11 Feb 2020 14:56:29
Investment? How much money has your manager had since he took over? Plenty is the answer
Pogba was never good enough. Fergie got rid for a reason. Take your rose tinted off and smell the coffee.

11 Feb 2020 15:57:01
Who is this Pogba you all talk about?

11 Feb 2020 16:30:04
I like Pogba but he's been chronically mismanaged in my opinion.

Expectations have remained unrealistically high with many fans and pundits alike expecting him to play like Kante, Yaya Toure and Zidane all rolled into one.

Pogba almost singlehanded has borne the weight of expectation and frustration in this post Fergi apocalypse yet he hasn't had the players around him to release his potential or relieve the pressure.

Mourinho bought him and misused him. He wanted him to perform a disciplined and rigid role in front of the back 4 and utilise his physicality instead of his skills. A war of egos was perhaps inevitable.

Pogba will thrive with better players around him and whilst his exuberant character and personality has rubbed many up the wrong way if he does eventually leave in the summer he'll be no doubt be joining a much better team than the one he's leaving.

Ironically with the acquisition of Fernandes I actually think we potentially have a frightening good midfield trio. With either Fred, Mctominay or even Matic for that matter anchoring the midfield with Pogba and Fernandes either side it has all the characteristics of being a dynamic, powerful and creative unit. Sadly we'll probably never see it play.

The sale of Pogba will not end all our problems and for those who think he will be adequately replaced probably need a reality check. Another scapegoat by the name of Lukaku springs to mind.

{Ed047's Note - Pogba isn’t a scape goat, he’s a woeful excuse for a professional footballer who’s made his name off the back of others.

There are countless midfielders out there that would be so much better in your midfield. Does David Silva need better players around him to be awesome, no, he shows up himself.

He’s a massive embarrassment to not just himself but your club too.

11 Feb 2020 18:38:57
Ed047 - Those kind of comments belong on Arsenal Tv. I'd rather talk about his footballing ability rather than a character assassination knowing nothing about the man.

I don't expect people to agree with me and understand Pogba polarises opinion but this kind of vitriol is unnecessary the blokes just a footballer after all.

In my opinion Pogba is a fantastic player who unfortunately hasn't been able to live up to expectations or perform consistently in a team that has often lacked direction or identity.

If he's sold in the summer I wish him all the best and bare him no ill feeling. He's not the the first player to arrive at Old Trafford and not been able to live up to expectations and he certainly won't be the last. That's just football and we move on.

{Ed047's Note - never watched Arsenal Tv, but if you want to make excuses for the guy, fill your boots.

He’s not just a footballer though is he, he’s a highly paid professional and lauded as World Class but consistently fails to show up and if he’s not a constant embarrassment to your club I don’t know what is.

He doesn’t cut the mustard or shall I just agree he's great, good, not bad, a nice guy or whatever else you think? 🤷‍♂️

11 Feb 2020 18:53:13
DLIB, while I agree Pogba has been made a scapegoat to a certain extent (although I think he brings a lot of it on himself) . I don't agree that he has been that badly mismanaged.

You talk about the rigid style of play he was asked to play under Jose as being a problem for him. While I didn't enjoy that style I don't think it should have hampered Pogba that much. After all he had moved from Juventus who had been managed by both Conte and Allegri neither managers known for playing fluid football, but a robust defensive style which requires everyone to work hard off the ball and defend as a team.
While his national team manager is Deschamps, another defensively minded manager who wants all his players to work hard and fit into a strict system.

Fact is very few top level managers will allow a player to be a passenger. They expect them all to work hard and fulfil their roles in the side. Only the very very best players are indulged at the top level by managers, often because they have such ability that they can win a game with a moment of brilliance.

So I don't by this he was asked to tackle and that doesn't suit his game.

Pogba has several great attributes, physically strong, quick, technically gifted, excellent dribbler, good shot and has the ability to hit accurate 60 yard passes to feet.

He should be able to play deep and use his skills to win the ball, dribble through a press and play defence splitting passes.

He should be able to play in a box to box role and use his dribbling to carry himself up field before slipping someone through or having a shot.

Pogba has the skills to play any role in midfield. The problem is he doesn't have the attitude to do it. He doesn't want to track back, he just wants to do the highlight reel stuff. Which is fine when he has 10 other world class players along side him to carry him when he can't be bothered. And for that reason if he joined a top side he would look better.

He has the wrong attitude and that will always stop him being the player he could be. We need to sell him ASAP and move on.

11 Feb 2020 19:32:30
Shappy - I agree he's been disappointing, we should probably sell him and move on I just don't agree with the personal insults.

I think he can play all those roles but I stand by my comments that we wanted him to tackle like Kante, dribble and pass like Zidane and play with the strength and power of Toure. I think we all thought we were getting the complete midfielder who was going to dominate the league with his strength, power and skill and to those lofty expectations there is no doubt he's largely disappointed.

Yes he's lacked concentration on occasions, his defensive discipline and work rate could have been better but let's not forget we had other players in the squad not pulling their weight yet seemed to escape the fierce scrutiny and criticism levelled at Pogba.

Unfortunately we can't escape the fact that our best performances and results have been largely based around occasions where Pogba has performed. Few other players during his time at Old Trafford have stepped up and made the difference. The truth is if he didn't do it generally nobody did.

He's had nobody to share the burden or responsibility and whilst I don't feel sorry for him I don't necessarily think we've made the most of his talents.

Like I said ironically I think a midfield three of Mctominay, Fernandes and Pogba could be special. With a maturing Rashford if Pogba wanted to stay I think we have the basis of a very good team. I don't necessarily think replacing him will be as easy as some people think despite all his flaws and this is all redundant anyway as he still wants to leave and should be sold.

{Ed047's Note - perhaps you could enlighten me of the specific personal insult I used in your alleged vitriol, you know when I called him a name or said something vile about him.

Or did I just question his ability and how embarrassing he is?

I’m literally all ears.

11 Feb 2020 19:08:26
Well said 047
Shappy the most obvious thing wee are lacking is decent coaching.

11 Feb 2020 20:21:18
Ken, did you not feel we had that under LvG or Mourinho?

Which players did they improve? Since Sir Alex I can't remember any manager getting the most out of our squad or someone who had the ability to improve our players with their coaching.

11 Feb 2020 20:28:03
he is a player that thinks he is on the same levell as messi and ronaldo. he is not fit to lace there boots and with his attitude will never be regarded as world class. half the games you watch him play you have to look twice to see if he is on the pitch.

11 Feb 2020 21:00:43
Pogba was always going to be a disaster signing. I said before he signed that there would be a circus around him within 2 years and he would try to force his way out. I got shot down for it at the time. I am sure it will be in the archives somewhere.

Pogba is just a self centred showman who wants everyone else to do his dirty work. He is the embodiment of everything that is wrong with United. All show with no punch.

Why on earth the club felt it was a good idea to stop him leaving last year, or the year before for that matter, is being me.

He is an embarrasment to himself, and more importantly, the club.
Don't get me wrong, he has ability and lots of it. But ability is nothing without application, desire and the very basic requirement of respecting those around him. The ones he expects to do his hard work.

He needs to be gone yesterday.

11 Feb 2020 22:59:14
Pogba made it clear he wanted to leave the club last season and no one stumped up the cash for him. The offer of £27m and a player no one wants, was evidence enough of how highly the football world rate him.

When the going gets tough, Pogba packs his case. He’s an embarrassment and the sooner he leaves the better.

11 Feb 2020 23:01:54
Shappy lvg win a cup jose won 3 poor league campaigns but as you say everyday they did it with terrible players.

11 Feb 2020 23:25:14
Pogba is one of those players who is at his best when he has top quality players around him, but not someone who has the temperament to carry a team when it is struggling. He is a showman. He is not a leader. He will fit in very well at one of the top European clubs where his undoubted talent can shine. He will then prove the pundits who underrate him wrong. If United get £70-80m and lose his wages they should jump at it. since he only has a year left on his initial contract the club will show a significant profit on the amortized registration fee.

12 Feb 2020 05:22:31
One of the Eds previously summed Pogba perfectly.
"Pogba plays when Pogba chooses to play"

DLIB, I'm a fan of Pogba when he shows up.
However, to a large extent, he has been unprofessional.
Remember him having a spat with Jose for not allowing him to travel back in his Rolls Royce rather than the team bus.

It just shows he isn't matured enough.
The collective team is always most important than an individual. He also doesn't seem to be motivated enough to push for our club's rebuild.

These can all be fixed by having a proper footballing structure. In future, we must avoid players who come just for money or come with baggage.

12 Feb 2020 06:18:48
Ken, no doubt they won things with a poor squad. But other than filling out the trophy cabinet a little how did that help the club in the long run?

Short term success over long term improvement.

We don't need a manager/ coach who will win us things with 2 years if that man isn't improving our players.

The make up of our squad is one heavily leaning on young potential. Players like Henderson, AWB, Tuanzebe, Williams, Shaw, McTominay, Levitt, Garner, Andreas Pereira, James, Chong, Gomes, Rashford, Greenwood and Martial are all under the age of 24, most under the age of 21.

All these players need help to grow and improve as players if they are to fulfill their potential. The other option is we get a manager who just thinks about who he can buy to improve the side. If we go down the buying route then we need to probably buy 12-14 players at least over the next few windows and hope they all settle quickly.

We don't need a manager who will favour winning something now over developing the players we have. If we focus on improving our players winning things will come.

12 Feb 2020 14:05:08
On a lighter not, i just googled Vitriol.





 

 

 
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