Manchester United banter 80727


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05 Oct 2018 12:53:47
The divide Is becoming clear.

On one hand we have Fellaini, Matic, Young, Lukaku, etc.

Whilst on the other we have Pogba, Martial, Lingard, Rashford, etc.

I'm still backing Mou though, I'd rather be a club that stuck with their manager and move on the trouble makers - no matter how difficult that may be regardless of the style of football than let our top players (he's been here 2 years and he's acting like it's his club) dictate the managerial changes.

The grass isn't always greener on the other side.

Also, let's not forget Mourinho wanted Perisic not Sanchez and would have liked Varane (or similar) .

He even wanted new fullbacks.

Seeing as this team has glaring on field issues costing us games at fullback, centre back on a creative front with Sanchez why is anyone surprised by the outcome?

Morale is low because of the divide but if he got who he wanted I guarantee we'd be talking about how good we've been.

I'm not saying he's perfect, far from it's but if you give him players who believe in him he'll deliver you trophies. If you let Pogba constantly mouth off you're letting the rest of the squad question our approach.

Back him and let him build his way (as he didn't at Inter, Porto and Chelsea pt1) or play Tug of war with player power and watch the undermining of our manager be what's beats us.

You don't go from best in the world for a decade to nothing just like that. We're the problem here not him.

Commitment from the club would be nice but so would commitment from Mourinho - IE getting his arse out of the hotel.

{Ed001's Note - you do realise Lukaku is not in any camp separate from his best mate Pogba right? So your talk of it being clear is obviously false, you would only have to see the tunnel at the weekend when the likes of Shaw all made a point of a handshake and pat on the back off Mourinho, while Lukaku totally and completely blanked him, even when standing next to him for a time while waiting to go out.}

Agree2 Disagree7

05 Oct 2018 13:11:50
Mourinho only ever does three seasons tops with a club, he’s on his third season with us .
We’ve seen what happens at other clubs when he goes into meltdown, it generally just gets worse not better .
So what exactly is the benefit in backing Mourinho when there no future in it.

05 Oct 2018 14:03:53
Your first group, fellaini, matic and young have one glaring difference to the other group : they are 30 + and in the last couple of years of careers at a big club. They have probably seen turmoil in he dressing rooms at former clubs and can't be arsed to get involved. Content to get playing time as such. The second group although only 5- 10 years younger are from a different world in terms of social media and the ever increasing player power and agent manipulation of situations. I don't think JM or indeed a few other managers can grasp the changes and the necessity to change tactics when dealing with it but having the correct backroom personel AND letting them deal with it could diffuse all the crap that's been reported in the press. The players need a go between sometimes with exception to the footba- after all every EPL game isn't 22 players simply playing for their respective jersey's ;its 22 millionaires with a vast majority of them thinking they have "made" it.

05 Oct 2018 14:21:15
Morale is low because the players are being asked to play a flawed and outdated system, and when things don’t work the manager throws them under the bus rather than accept some responsibility.

There isn’t really a clear divide either. There are a few players going out of their way to back Jose because their status at the club is depending on him remaining in post. There are a few players openly at odds with Jose because they are concerned that he is being detrimental to their careers and/ or they’re trying to force through a move away from the club. The vast majority of players are trying to stay out of the way. They want the club to get back to winning ways, and are most likely frustrated by the whole situation.

05 Oct 2018 14:31:27
He wanted a full back, and he got Dalot, who's looked raw, but decent. Shaw has probably been our best player since the start of the season, so I don't see full backs being the problem, more how they're asked to play.

{Ed002's Note - Dalot is one for the future rather than a first pick player now.}

05 Oct 2018 16:05:40
Ed001, There have been many reports over the past few months of Lukaku distancing himself from Pogba because he doesn't want to impact his relationship with Mourinho - how true it is I do not know.

regardless of where the divide is, I think it's clear we've got issues and differing opinions among the playing staff which is undermining the manager's approach in my opinion.

Bilko, this isn't exactly usual territory for Mourinho though in terms of the state he picked our club up in. It only gets worse at clubs where players think they know better and stop believing, those where they've kept the faith he's been very successful - Inter, Chelsea (first time), Porto to name the obvious 3. - at Madrid he had Ramos and Casillas constantly questioning him, at Chelsea it was Hazard and here it's Pogba.

There is only no point to it if we don't go all in, if we do go all in with him, he gets a house close to the club, we commit to him, etc. then I can actually see it working out well but we need to go all in or not at all.

Cookyman, that's a good observation. I'd argue it's because the younger generation of today's game think they know everything and the older players can be a little wiser on some occasions.

I completely agree with what you're saying to be honest. I think even Sir Alex would have struggled a little with the new age of players. Mourinho NEEDS everyone buying into the system for it to work - that's not happening right now, unfortunately.

Danny, that flawed and outdated system is very similar to the one Real Madrid just won 3 back to back championships with, or the one that got Atletico being spoken about as an elite club. There's nothing wrong with strong counter-attacking football and real defensive principles (Inter vs Barcelona a few years back was fantastic defensively, if we could produce performances like Inter then I'd be okay with it) .

To me there is a clear divide, we could go through the players all day but that's just my opinion at the end of the day really. Those that think Mourinho is harming their career need to realise that they're doing that themselves by failing to show up week after week. Not exactly very professional is it? Another reason why I'd prefer Mourinho to Pogba and co any day of the week.

Noucamp99, He didn't want a child for the future, he wanted someone to come in and take game time from Valencia and Young. Shaw has upped his game and fair play to him, but Valencia has been dire and you can't tell me replacing him with say, Kimmich, for example, would have been a huge upgrade.

if you're saying to me I can have; Pogba, Rashford and Martial or I can keep Mourinho; I'm keeping Mourinho.

We've had the same issues since Sir Alex left, this is a club-wide problem, not a managerial problem. Let's deal with it by keeping the best in the business employed at United - which Mourinho is.

{Ed001's Note - Lukaku and Pogba have not distanced themselves at all. The reports are just trash.}

05 Oct 2018 16:48:20
So let me get this straight. Under Jose, Madrid never progressed past the CL semis, but his approach was instrumental to them winning three in a row a full two seasons after he left? Should Jose be thanking Davy Moyes for his Europa league success.

I might be a bit off, but I don’t recall Zidane’s Madrid sides putting ten players behind the ball to sit deep with minimal pressing, or resorting to long balls to the big man. Your example of Inter v Barcelona is telling because that is nearly a decade ago. Since then teams have adapted and worked on strategies to counter Jose’s bus parking. It’s telling that as other coaches have adapted and evolved, Jose’s approach has become less and less effective. But yeah, all hail Jose for the Real’s CL treble, which he played no part in achieving.

05 Oct 2018 14:03:06
You sure they're best mates Ed? Remember them being close when Lukaku signed but they're not as close as they were according to 'reports', distanced him self from Pogba after all the negative publicity/ press.

{Ed001's Note - they are still close according to one of their agencies, who have still been offering them for jobs as a pair. I am sure you can guess the agency.}

05 Oct 2018 17:34:23
Just seen your response to Moon on falsing reports, my bad Ed. Thanks.

{Ed001's Note - no worries mate.}

05 Oct 2018 19:36:12
That's all well and good Moon, but the football under Mourinho is going to be boring rubbish no matter what happens.

This above all else is why he has to go.

There's something in philosophy called the principle of induction which is when we expect the future based on the past. I think you and numerous others are guilty of this, although when it comes to Mourinho there are less than there were six months ago.

05 Oct 2018 19:57:43
Don’t understand this “if Jose got who he wanted he would be doing well”. He wanted Pogba and can’t get a tune from him, he wanted Matic and he’s slower than my gran, he wanted Bailly and doesn’t play him. He wanted Lukaku who can’t finish his dinner, he has spent a lot of money on players he wanted, and yet we’re still dross. Who’s fault is it then.

05 Oct 2018 20:38:41
What he means Stand is that we should keep getting Jose players until he has a squad that do exactly what he says, and don’t give him any reason to fall out with them. If he loses the dressing room then get him a new one.

05 Oct 2018 21:12:32
If lukaku distanced himself from pogba for the sake of his own career, then he's a pretty poor friend. He can still be friends with him without getting involved in any issues he has. If mourinho gave that impression to any of the players then that's dreadful management, the players need to get on, if it's frowned upon to associate yourself with pogba because mourinhos having a spat with him then no wonder he wants out, that must be a terrible environment to go into every day school yard stuff.

06 Oct 2018 00:24:24
Jose Mourinho and Moon. Mourinho wanted cb's and he bought bailly and Lindleof. Bailly is good but has fallen out with the manager. Lindlehof is crap.
He wanted a defensive midfielder, so he bought matic and i said at the time, too slow and ponderous and getting on. He wanted a playmaker, so he bought Pogba and Mkhitaryan and has fallen out with both of them.
Are you telling us that all these players are wrong? Sanchez is a world class player, has looked like a 3rd division player.
Get rid of this person, let Carrick do the job, even if he's inexperienced, then appoint manager who believes in our club.
Gary Neville has a point in that the club hierarchy have no manners and are a bunch of gun slinging yanks, but unfortunately, they will be wrong in allowing Mourinho to carry on.

06 Oct 2018 14:30:24
Liverpool fan here, lads you lot need to back your manager if a was Jose, pogba would be playing with the ressies till Jan (and sold for as much as u can get for him) Then Jose would need to tell anyone else u buy into what am doing here or u will be along side pogba.
Things might change if he keeps pogba away from all first team football related stuff that been the dressing room aswell.
The rest of the players need to grow the fxxk up and do what the getting paid huge sums of money to do and that's show up and play football the way they are told to do, weather they like the tactics or not.
One thing about Jose is he is proving in winning trophies he might not play exciting football but he knows how to win.
As a Liverpool fan the one thing I don't want come may when we win the league is you lot trying to take it away from us by saying stuff like, u only had to beat one team, and it was the easiest season to win the league, abit like Leicester. A would prefer every team be at there best because reguardless we will still win the league even with every other team playing there best football.
Peace lads over and out.



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