Manchester United banter 78916

 

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13 Apr 2018 18:56:19
I didn't divorce my wife when she decided to shift allegiances to Arsenal rather than United. Perhaps I should have. In the end I managed to wean her off the game by taking her to OT for a United Arsenal match. It was the one where Rashford scored twice. We were in some very good seats on the half way line. The United supporters next to her behaved so vilely in their language and manner she felt overwhelmed and threatened. It completely destroyed her interest in supporting anyone. I don't think she really understood just how deep the passions run until then. We had also been to the Etihad a few seasons earlier and sat in the Arsenal seats. It was nowhere near as bad.

In another match against West Ham in those same seats at OT a couple of WHU supporters had acquired seats in front of us (not the Mrs. this time) . West Ham scored the winner in the closing seconds (later disallowed for a marginal offside) . The two supporters cheered the goal. The United fans around them started threatening them with violence. It was disgraceful.

. but then was it any better in the 60s when I started going to OT in the days of United Aggro? It's never really been a place for the timid or easily offended.

{Ed001's Note - it was before then in the early days. It was after WW2 that support became more tribal and less friendly.}

Agree0 Disagree0

13 Apr 2018 19:45:19
I don't go to games anymore. I'm not scared or intimidated so much as disgusted at the people around me. What about others? Anyone admit to being one of the yobs we're complaining about? Why is it ok in a stadium and not anywhere else?

13 Apr 2018 20:49:44
I would be guilty of using bad language at a game, now I wouldn't single anyone out or abuse them,
I would be the kind of bloke, play hard at the game, shake hands after.
I'd have no problem having a chat meeting other teams fans after.
In Ireland at the big gaa matches there would be tension, bad language, fierce rivalry, the odd bit of hate and a very odd few belts thrown between fans, but they could be sitting together and walk out of the ground together,
Their wouldn't be any groups waiting for each other.
Now I played hurling and seen plenty of fights and rows on the pitch but we would shake hands after.
Now some refs are good and some are one sided
I watched a programme last year of the all Ireland football final and the ref had a microphone attached and it showed every word said during the game and he was a good fair ref took no messing off the players but he spoke with respect to the players.

13 Apr 2018 22:42:03
Remember going to my first (and only) GAA game years ago, Leahy. Down v Kerry in Dublin. Asked one of the fellas where I should sit, and he just told me anywhere, there was no segregation. I nearly fell over!

13 Apr 2018 22:42:22
I love a rugby crowd. Passion without abuse. Same as the players (for the most) .

13 Apr 2018 22:51:07
Lol 99, the rugby have great passion and respect
Even when the other team is taking a free kick. not a word, silence.

13 Apr 2018 23:26:21
I think the rugby crowds are amazing at murrayfield, millennium stadium and in Dublin. But twickenham is a posh boys fest. No passion and it’s an old boys club. I found it very tame when I went and I prefer football crowds.

I will admit I get frustrated when I go to old Trafford but I’ve never been one to stand up and hurl abuse at the referee or the opposition players. I’ll boo but that’s as far as I go. It’s embarrassing to see grown men abusing players and then to watch there 5 year old son copying him and doing the finger. I would love to be able to take my kids when I have them to watch a game of football but I’m not sure it’s the example that I would want to set.

14 Apr 2018 00:15:35
Park I agree with you and other posters that talked about going to games and all that. I have kids myself and no one wants them to see this.
But I have a but, most of us grew up with football violence was a lot worse and if our parents didn't bring us to games where would we be now with football. I'm glad mine bought me to games when I was young,
And for me it made me a bit streetwise to the whole thing,
I took my oldest girl to old Trafford when she was 8 and I told her you will hear bad language and stuff like That, she said ok then after a few games took no notice of it, she has been to other sporting games as well and takes all that comes with it in her stride, Now my second youngest is a bit softer and she doesn't like when things get heated but she still goes to games.
And my youngest is hard as nails and takes no notice what so ever.
I love old Trafford and will always take one of my girls when I go but I really do look out for them when there, don't leave them out of my sight.

14 Apr 2018 09:28:42
Society has moved on a lot and what was ok 20 years ago isn’t ok now. There is no racist chanting now apart from the odd moron and hooliganism is now very isolated and much less prevalent than it was (it hasn’t gone away) . I also believe that in the next 10 years a lot of players will come out and most fans will just shrug their shoulders and say “so”? There will the odd homophobic idiot as we have seen in rugby but society has moved on and those people will stand out as the bigots they are.

Having said that not everything has got better. People dropping their kids off at school whilst wearing their pyjamas, men waking round town centres and shops with bare chests in summer, t-shirts with offensive words or phrases on them. Swearing is prevalent on the TV, I remember when the f word on T made the front page of the press, not watch Gordon Ramsey and try and count how many times you hear it.

However, in football, some challenges remain. In some big games the hatred you can feel is palpable and if I’m honest a little ridiculous. It’s a game, a sport. Nobody wants to win more than me but I don’t hate opponents. I’m sure a lot of United fans hated Michael Owen and suddenly he’s scoring the winner in the Manchester derby; Liverpool fans loved him but now hate him as he came to play for us. Sheesh people, grow up.

Singing at grounds is fabulous but some songs would get your I arrested if you sang them int he street. Why is this ok? Well it isn’t but nobody has the balls to deal with it. Offensive gestures, fans abusing players, all under the eyes of stewards and sometimes police and nobody bats an eyelid. If the stewards starting ejection people, or noting their seat numbers and writing to them (season ticket holders) then we might see a change. It’s like the standing up issue, the Council threatens to close the ground but yen doesn’t so everyone carries on standing up.

I was at Anfield in ‘92 the day we lost the League, sat in the Liverpool end opposite the Kop (we bought tickets outside from a tout) . It was my first experiment of Anfield and I have never experienced hatred like it. They knew we were United fans but we played badly, lost, we behaved ourselves and left very early before any trouble started. Contrast that to when we went to Coventry where all around the ground you could see United shirts and not a hint of trouble. So it’s something tribal, long held rivalries, or games against your main competitors that brings out the worst in people.

Whatever it is we need to keep the passion but lose the hatred. I don’t really enjoy going anymore, maybe I’ve just got old or maybe I’ve moved on and football hasn’t.

Revolution, that’s what we need.

{Ed001's Note - a lot of football historians believe the problem stems from segregation, and I think they have a point. When Liverpool and Everton were sat together it was nothing like as nasty as it has become now they are segregated. Not sure how we would reverse the process to return to mixing in together and showing respect to others though.}

14 Apr 2018 09:50:01
I remember reading something once about how in Manchester an Liverpool fans of both clubs would sit together in the derby games. And how when one team was away they'd go watch the one that was home that weekend. can't imagine it now.

14 Apr 2018 12:16:31
The only punishment that seems to have any sort of effect is points deductions. Particularly if it results in losing a title or relegation for a team.

The only issue is that it punishes the normal fans who don't act like idiots.

14 Apr 2018 13:15:51
Tony, you, me and Beast should be the next participants on Grumpy Old Men. My frustration at modern-day society has me tearing out what's left of my hair.

14 Apr 2018 14:02:11
Me too Stevie, and don’t get me started on adhering to all the new rules. I don’t have an ‘ism’ in me but it’s hard keeping up with all the rules about what is ok and isn’t ok.

14 Apr 2018 22:09:36
In many ways the vile abusive language at matches is just a reflection of how standards of respect and tolerance have fallen in society in general. So called comedians just have to utter the F word to get a laugh. Listen to people speak everyday and F word is commonplace. Robbery and theft is so prevalent that the police don't have the time to investigate properly. There has been a breakdown in dare I say good old fashioned values. This is because families are fragmented. We have a society where kids grow up not knowing who their father is because he is absent. They therefore have no role models or if they do its the wrong type. This is not to slight or offend the amazing efforts of many single parents but it cannot be a coincidence that there are so many problems in our society. I took my kids to a football match at Chelsea. They were 7 and 8 years old. The steward told them to take off their Utd scarves so as not to provoke Chelsea supporters. How perverse is that. Then during the match there was a torrent of four letter words from surrounding Chelsea fans. When I complained that there were kids present we were told to F off. The stewards were not interested when I complained. Contrast that to rugby matches and you see the problem. Football has to encourage fans to mix and it has to enforce a strict policy of no tolerance for foul and abusive language from the fans. It also need s to do more to encourage the next generation of fans. Having mixed family seating areas where young families of both teams supporters sit might be the way to start.

{Ed007's Note - Vote Tory! All these bloody single parents bringing their kids up to swear at football matches! They're probably paying for season tickets off their benefits as well! The filthy B@$tArds!!!!!!

hedonred

14 Apr 2018 22:31:41
i think it's a reflection on general society, only in the past 100 years or so because of the influx of immigrants from other countries people are being more progressive and more accepting of people different than themselves (whether it has merits or not is not discussed here), so what you essentially have is a group of people who heavily invest their identities in their local football teams because of a) a lack of education (hooligans don't help in this regard) b) zealous tribalism where you're unaccepting of anything that's considered different than what your club may permit, notice how there is a very stern opposition to foreign fans in the premier league despite them being responsible for the revenue etc? it stemmed from that.







 

 

 
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