Manchester United banter 78392

 

Use our rumours form to send us manchester united transfer rumours.


(single word yields best result)

26 Feb 2018 06:39:24
Just a thought, a leader is needed in defence for me, it would be great if they were world class and from these isles too, so what do you fellas think about lascelles from the bar codes?2 out of 3 ain't bad, puts himself about, seems to be the
leader in their back line and has got better season upon season while at forest and then at newcastle, maybe offer them maybe smalling and some sheckles, worth a
punt?

Agree1 Disagree6

26 Feb 2018 07:15:46
CO82

I agree on the leader in CD and suggested Harry Maguire as an option about a week ago and he is English. However it gained many disagrees so that rules him out.

{Ed001's Note - he is terrible RM. Positionally awful, on his best days, is just a big, strong lump who throws himself into last ditch tackles he should never have needed to make, but people don't notice the ball watching he was doing prior to that when he could otherwise have easily got in position to see out the danger without needing the tackle. Oh and those runs forward, 99 times out of 100 he just gives the ball away on those charges and leaves a huge gaping hole at the back by doing so. No leader either as he is so busy ball watching he does not command the backline at all. Leicester have been wide open defensively since the day he joined and it is not a coincidence. Hull were woeful as well and he was a big part of that. If he wasn't English I doubt any commentator would big him up as they would be too busy pointing out his numerous errors a game.

I watched one game and he gave the ball away 8 times and not once did the commentator say his name. Then he made one easy 10 yard pass and the commentator was salivating over his ability on the ball! The very next time he got the ball and dallied on it, getting robbed by the forward and the commentator said, and I quote, "that was very unlike Maguire to make a mistake". I turned the sound off after that!}

26 Feb 2018 07:40:12
Ed001 LMAO 🤣🤣🤣
Ok with the original post but thoroughly enjoyed you response. Classic 👍👏.

{Ed001's Note - thanks mate, he is one of those players that annoys me, along with Wilshere is another one. They get so many plaudits yet never do anything constructive for their team to earn them. It is very true what they say about English players being overrated.}

26 Feb 2018 07:52:21
Ed001 we all know there are such in almost every teams. It’s just more or less obvious 🤣 but yeah I know that feeling 🤣.

{Ed001's Note - true, good point.}

26 Feb 2018 08:11:09
Harry McGuire cannot distribute the ball and these days, thus us a prerequisite for a world class full back. If you want someone to hoof it up there every time the ball comes near him, then McGuire is that person. But I'm hoping we actually transform our team to a footballing side sometime soon, some TA from spurs will be my choice and he's a leader.

{Ed001's Note - now Alderweireld is a player! Not just a top class defender but he can play as well. A proper ball playing centre half that lad.}

26 Feb 2018 08:43:20
Alderweireld would be my first chocie as well think is best CB in league.

26 Feb 2018 08:51:58
I don’t get this fascination with signing more centre backs, are our centre backs world class? No, but then again who is?

Seriously this is something I’ve been thinking about a lot lately, where have all the great centre backs gone?

We have the old guard, players such as Chiellini, Bonucci, Godin, Pepe and Thiago Silva who were at some point considered world class.
Then you have those that are still considered world class such as Ramos, Koscielny, Vertonghen, Hummels and Alderweireld some of which I would consider questionable. Certainly I don’t think any of them will be making the list of all time great centre backs.
After that you have a choice between players who have occasionally hit world class form without the consistency to be considered world class such as Glik, Garay, Toprak and Evans. Or talented youngsters who are supposedly the next big thing such as Laporte, Skriniar, Marquinhos, Upamecano ect. But for every one of them who make that jump you have 3, 4 or 5 such as Jones, Ginter or Kjaer who never lived up to the billing.

So with few if any genuine world class players available our options are decent also rans or young players with potential who may or may not make it.
We have Bailly and Lindelof who fit the category of young players with bags of potential, we have Jones and Rojo who fit the bill of decent also rans. We also have young Axel Tuanzebe who I feel has massive potential. So with three young players with potential it seems pointless adding another one in that category, why waste time and money on buying another solid player who doesn’t really improve us when we have Jones and Rojo. We should only be making a signing at centre back if we can sign a world class player, as I’ve said very few actually fit that bracket, maybe only Toby Alderweireld who might actually be available this summer. So for me it should be Alderweireld or no one this summer.

26 Feb 2018 09:38:27
Shappy,

Alderweireld is on a different level to Smalling, him and Bailly could be our first choice partnership for years, that is why people are 'fascinated' with buying a centre half.

26 Feb 2018 10:51:11
GDS, I agree that Alderweireld would be an improvement IF we could get him. However, my point was that I don't see many if any other centre backs who could significantly improve us. All I see is good young players with potential, and as I've pointed out we have three of them. I would rather give them a chance than spend time and money chasing players who would't really improve us.

I feel we need a central midfielder who can control a game and competition/ added quality at full back. That's it.

26 Feb 2018 11:01:29
My thoughts are that Lindelof is starting to come into his own and Rojo, Jones and Smalling can do a job but a back two out of these three always looks a bit dodgy. Each of them need someone to 'steady the ship' when they are being rash or caught out of position.
We all can see how good Baily is when he gets the chance but i'm concerned about his injury record so far, he hasn't had a decent number of months to see how good he can be. I just hope he isn't our 'Ledley King'. But having said all that the defence although not earth shattering, have the chance to be solid if the combination is kept right but reckon it will always be a fluent one rather than a strong double act. I don't think spending more will solve much because the ones who might make a difference such as Picque, Varane and Ramos are unattainable so we may expect a frustrating few years of defensive uncertainty but it will still be enough to help us get results and hopefully trophies.

26 Feb 2018 11:10:41
Couldn’t agree more with ed on Maguire. Don’t understand the fascination with him. I would much rather we trusted Lindelof then go and spend £50m on Maguire. He is only getting praise because he is English. He always gives the ball away and is caught out positionally. If we were to sign a cb, and there was a chance we could, then I would break the bank for Alderweireld who is the best cb in the league. Otherwise I would go with a pairing of bailly and Lindelof with Rojo, tuanzebe and Jones as back ups. Invest heavily in 2 new full backs and a top cm who can dictate the tempo of play and pick a pass and we have the makings of a very good side.

26 Feb 2018 11:18:05
Is Bailly injury prone?

I can't remember him suffering many if any injuries last season? He went to the Afcon so we missed him for a few weeks then, but my memory is he played nearly every week.

He suffered his first real injury this season, he was out for a while, we rushed him back and he had a recurrence of the same injury which has kept him out until now.

RvN had a serious injury before we signed him, yet it never really caused an issue during his time with us. Every player suffers injury from time to time, but I don't think Bailly is injury prone. I think people have that view because Phil Jones does tend to be, Smalling and Rojo have picked up a few over the last couple of years but how much of that is due to them being rushed back and not being fully fit when being thrown back in due to us being in an "injury crisis"?

Like I said, I have high hopes for Tuanzebe and feel he should be getting several games next season. We have Bailly who is clearly first choice, Lindelof has shown signs of starting to get to grips with the EPL. We also have Jones who has been one of our best CB's when fit under Mourinho and Rojo who has rarely let us down when he has been called upon at CB. So that's five players for what is likely two positions.

If Alderwiereld is available then we should maybe have a look as he is one of the few who would improve us, but I don't think we should be signing someone for the sake of it or someone with "potential" we have many of those.

26 Feb 2018 12:38:57
I don't think Bailly is injury prone as well As happy. For me injury prone means getting injured regularly and Bailly has had a long injury lay off but due to just one.
I also see people saying Alderweireld is injury prone in some places and I don't agree there either. Getting a longer layoff due to single injury doesn't make you injury prone but regularly getting injured means injury prone be it niggling injuries or mid to long term ones.

What do you make of Lascelles Esq?
Also on point of defenders it seems to be an issue everywhere not just England, the general level of defenders/ defending has gone down everywhere I think. There are only about half a dozen or maybe less CBs I would consider proper WorldClass where as just the PL had that much (maybe more) a decade or so ago.

26 Feb 2018 11:55:29
Hi Ed001

Thanks interesting thoughts on Maguire. I like most would prefer Alderweireld but I wonder if he is playing to get the pay rise he wants plus Spurs are notorious to deal with.

{Ed001's Note - playing? Spurs won't give him the pay rise he wants because they would then have the rest of the team demanding similar deals, as United are finding since giving Zlatan obscene money it raises the bar for every player. If Alderweireld will not lower his demands they will get rid in the summer.}

26 Feb 2018 12:54:47
There's not many good full backs around either.

26 Feb 2018 13:02:13
Ed001

Thank you

I do think we have to improve central defence but dealing with Levy is not easy.

{Ed001's Note - this would be a sale he is choosing to make though, so it should be a bit easier than usual.}

26 Feb 2018 13:20:41
Thank you Ed

Encouraging indeed.

{Ed001's Note - welcome.}

26 Feb 2018 13:28:25
Ed001

Do you think if spurs sell Alderweireld will come back to haunt them? Vertonghen is a very good player but never been convinced by Davinson Sanchez who i think relies on his pace too much as he makes too many mistakes and positional errors. Dier is not great as a cb either.

{Ed001's Note - Sanchez is awful, he has no defensive mindset. They would not want to lose him, they know he is the best of the lot but they know if he doesn't sign a contract they will lose him on a free the following summer. Better to get what you can rather than risk a player who might not be at his best.}

26 Feb 2018 13:44:53
I totally agree ed I thought Sanchez was terrible against us when playing for Ajax in the Europa League final last year. If you had to put money on it where do you think Alderweireld will end up next season?

26 Feb 2018 13:52:54
Deependra, I think Lascelles is very middle of the road. Decent, solid, but lacking the ability to step it up in my opinion. I wonder if any of these decent defenders would look as good in a different time when we had many top class defenders. Not that long ago we were blessed with players such as Nesta, Maldini, Cannavaro, Hierro, Puyol, Stam, Thuram, Lucio, Samuel, Ferdinand, Vidic, Terry, Campbell, Carvalho, Ayala and Desailly all had their careers overlap in the past 20 years. It's not like I'm harking back to Bobby Moore or Beckenbauer.

I think the reason we are struggling to create world class centre backs now is in part to how the game has changed, and what is expected of a centre back now. I don't think the training has kept pace with the speed the game has changed. 10 years ago we seemed to just decide all centre backs need to be playmakers as well. It was such a shift in expectations that the kids coming through had no chance of adapting.

I think that's starting to change, and my hope is more of these young lads coming through will have been trained in and taught how to thrive in modern football, and will be able to step up to that world class bracket. However, until we see more and more achieve that too class young centre backs will cost a premium.

26 Feb 2018 14:51:55
Love you ed1. Giving us hope Alderweireld might be a possible signing but still there will be tough competition for him that I am sure of. Although not the proper page could you share who Spurs might turn to if he leaves? I think they might go to De Vrij on a free if Alderweireld leaves. Would be a Spurs and Levy kind of move. Make more profit.

{Ed001's Note - I think you might well be miles off, though he is a Levy kind of signing, he is not a Poch-type of player. He is slower than a week of Mondays and injury prone. Poch likes strong, fast players and I expect him to look for one, such as a Varane type.}

26 Feb 2018 14:56:23
I don't think Lascelles has warranted a move to a team with hopes of challenging for the league and CL yet. I am not sure about him. I think Ben Mee of Burnley has performed more regularly than any other guy in the lower teams but even he I don't think has done enough to warrant a move to a top side. What is your opinion on Mee ed1 I think he is their best defender but his partners always get
The media attention.

{Ed001's Note - Mee has been outstanding, carries the Burnley team at times but he is not young mate. I think he is 29 or will be soon. However I did say throughout the summer Everton were making a huge mistake signing the utterly average Keane when they should have moved heaven and earth to get Mee.}

26 Feb 2018 15:31:27
Yes ed1 he will be 29 in September according to his Wiki page (did do a quick Google search) i think he would be a perfect fit for an Everton or a Leicester but I don't think he will be completely out of his depth even at Liverpool. But maybe he doesn't need to leave Burnley they are looking likely to finish 7/ 8 this season.

On a side note ed1 any CBS caught your eye recently that isn't mentioned much in Europe not just england.

{Ed001's Note - I don't know who isn't mentioned much to be honest, I don't have time to read transfer links etc. Jose Giminez is the obvious name I can think of as a decent young defender. Skriniar is highly rated but he did not impress me on the 2 occasions I got to see him. Other obvious ones are Tah, Upamecano, Lucas Hernandez. One I think could be worth a look is the young Atalanta lad, Caldara, he impressed me in the Europa League and I have seen him a couple of times in Serie A this season he looked good. Murillo looks like he could make the grade at a top club as well. There are a couple of young defenders in France I have been told to keep an eye out for as well, one is at Nice, I forget where the other is at, Malang Sarr and Issa Diop. Not seen them play though so they might not be as good as I am told.}

26 Feb 2018 15:33:54
Would Varane be offloaded and would he go to Spurs where he probably will have to take a pay cut?

{Ed001's Note - I doubt Varane would but I was just meaning that is the kind of players Poch wants, athletes like Davinson Sanchez, rather than defenders like De Vrij who are painfully slow.}

26 Feb 2018 16:18:41
Caldara impressed me as well on the very few occasions I have seen Atalanta (last season mostly) but he is owned by Juventus I think or something like that. Issa Diop is (at least was) at Toulouse if I am not mistaken and from my memory is a huge monster. Also De Ligt gets good reviews but most importantly seems to have a good head, putting playing time ahead of sitting on the bench for Top team. Lemons (recently joined Sassuolo) was someone good for Las Palma's (last season he was this year I didn't watch them) he is a bit like VVD though in his build and all.

Also Ed how has Tah been doing this season? Built like a freak and impressed me few years ago. He is barely into his 20s yet seems to have been around for ages.

Finally Romagnoli seems to be developing well enough at Milan but not seen him much this year.

Basically I haven't been able to watch much football this season.







 

 

 
Log In or Register to post

User
Pass
Remember me

Forgot Pass