Manchester United banter 77141


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18 Oct 2017 13:37:05
I see a long thread on one of these pages about how Jose is a coward and people discussing his replacement, are you serious? Jred laid it out, we've scored a load of goals and barely conceded in all competitions so far but after 1 draw away at a title rival some are disgusted.
May I remind you of the Moyes and LVG eras where we was all baying for us just to win a game and turn those 1-1's into 2-1 wins, we are now winning games at a canter but suddenly now that's not enough, we should be going all out at Anfield and maybe Jose isn't the man, have a word some of you, look at the guys record, everyone knew before we hired him what he can do away at a big club so let's not act like it's a shock, he's got us contending again and winning well.

Agree15 Disagree0

18 Oct 2017 15:25:42
I saw a post from Marcellus on the Arsenal site for some reason (he's a United fan) which basically said:

1. We struggled to beat a poor Southampton team in the League Cup final
2. We had a pretty easy draw throughout the Europa Cup.
3. Until Liverpool we had played nobody in the top half.

I think the truth lies somewhere between his view and WRD's.

We are progressImg but watching City and Spurs shows what we are up against.

I remain unconvinced by Jose and I don't believe his heart is really in it, Ed suggested he was unhappy and II think he's sulking. Here's a question for you all. Wenger used to be fresh and radical test know he looks like yesterday's man. How far away is Jose form that? Seeing what Pochetino did last night was brilliant, 2 up front and take a risk. I just don't see Jose doing that against the big teams. So what you may say, he wins trophies. We'll see.

18 Oct 2017 15:40:59
Jose won the title 3 year ago unlike Arsen .
Poch got a draw away from home last night .
If at the start of the season some one said after 11 games United would of won 9 drew 2 lost 0 scored 32 goals conceded 4 nearly every fan would of been happy .
Not sure what more people want really .
It was a poor performance on Saturday just like spurs 00 draw with Swansea it won't be the last .

18 Oct 2017 15:56:08
Maybe 32 goals scored .
People wouldn't be very happy with 32 conceded if I'm honest.

18 Oct 2017 16:11:38
Joses track record suggests he only has short stays at clubs, i. e. 2-3 years. So it would be wise for the club to have a contingency plan if mourinho sticks to type.

18 Oct 2017 16:14:09
I think I sent a post by accident.

I don't disagree jred, I have enjoyed almost all our games so far. However let's see how we progress against the bigger teams and what mood Jose is in as the odd hiccup arrives. Happy to chage my mind, Pogba is proving to be way better than this I thought but whilst I've enjoyed our great start, I remain slightly uncomfortable with Jose. And Lukaku for that matter. I think we might see Inra for the big games and Lukaku scoring hat fills against the rest.

18 Oct 2017 16:45:32
Jred, we have done well all season, won games scored goals,
The issue is we went to anfield against an average back 4 and an average keeper and we didn't test them. we sat back when we should have went at them and had a go.

18 Oct 2017 16:57:07
Agreed Leahy. Embarrassing performance from us.

18 Oct 2017 17:29:20
In your opinion .
Liverpool have conceded 1 goal at home .
It very easy to say we should do this we should do that .
It looked a solid formation which I don't have an issue with against a strong attacking team away from home .
Our forwards where shocking, our passing in general was also shocking it was just a poor performance it happens .

But what your saying is if we had off had a go at them, set up gung ho all of our players would of played great.
The whole team would of been fantastic .

Is there any chance that after the international break etc the over hyped game we simple had a bad day at the office and played rubbish .

18 Oct 2017 17:35:42
If we had been playing say Madrid, Barcelona or Paris away in the knockout stages Europe a performance and result like that may be seen as professional . I think Liverpool seem to divide option as to wether it's a hard away game, two of our best players out be professional take the draw and no harm done or they aren't that great, iffy defense and gave them too much respect . Personally the answer was in the middle to me I understood the cautious approach but we should have offered a bit more than that as their decent but not top draw.
I hope and expect jm to realise if city continue steamrollering teams then we will need more than a dour draw in those type of games but we aren't at that point yet . I hope if we employ defensive tactics again we offer a bit more than we did on sat on the break.

18 Oct 2017 17:47:14
United v Chelsea last season .
Jose dropped ibra and played rash up top he dropped martial and Miki played linders young and fellaini also played darmian.
Herrera went man for man on hazard .
Sat behind the ball.

Won 2.0 it's a masterclass, great performance by the players on the day similar tactics to Saturday.

18 Oct 2017 18:02:38
I guess if Lukaku had taken his chance and we had won 1-0 we would be calling him a genius.

{Ed025's Note - but he never and you didn,t AJH and thats why he is getting the pelters he deserved mate..

18 Oct 2017 18:23:45
I can remember pointing out last season our defense was statistically good and people pointed out quite rightly yeah but they get a lot of cover and when we get a true defensive midfielder it will release others to play further forward . We get matic who's been one of our best players so far but first proper test and it didn't change our approach one jot. jose wins trophies but not thrill seekers .
Jm has found himself in a fortunate position now beating teams lower ranked handsomely, one or two have pointed out on here though not the hardest step to make as maybe we should have beat those teams last season aswell. I don't mean to sound to critical as one game against one decent team duznt mean all the other trickier games will be like that . all we know so far is we have learned to beat teams lower in the league easily and we can knock goals in against them and look good, we will be able to judge our progress in harder games in a few weeks and not on a one off game .

18 Oct 2017 18:48:37
Jred. I don't think Leahy is saying gung ho at all. He is saying we should have went for it a bit more. Any time lukaku got the ball there was no one near him, that's not down to our forwards having a poor game, that's down to tactics full stop.

You said yourself, we played badly so it's not just Leahys opinion bit also yours.

At the end of the day it's a point at anfield. Jose and many fans will see that as job done.

We have been very good of late, great start to the season it was the manner of the performance that fans are not happy with and rightfully so. It was a pathetic performance from a team that has been playing well against a team that really hasn't been playing well, that's all.

18 Oct 2017 19:09:09
Good thread. And wait for it. i'm in complete agreement with jred. Yeah i know!
We were awful and i don't agree with the approach but its what he will do 6 times a season. We might nick 2 draw 2 and lose 2 but i'd put up with that if the other 32 games were as enjoyable as the first 7 this season. That would win the league every season.
Its what jose does it frustrates me at times but its been a proven model for him. Simeone does the same at AM.
It was pathetic on sat.

18 Oct 2017 19:19:01
We played poor as a team .
The players had a off day .

Of course if we had played 3 up top all the same would players would of played great?

The balls in to lukaku where shocking our passing was shocking .
But if Jose had set up to attack more all of our passing would of been perfect?

Lukaku couldn't hold the ball up at all his first touch was poor ( was he playing with a knock) but a more attacking line up he would off been amazing, great first touch great hold up play?

Similar tactic to the Chelsea game imo, young darmian rash fellaini linders all brought in Herrera given 1 job look after hazard .

Players all played well so it's a masterclass.

Maybe it was just a bad game bad day at the office? Maybe we won't win every game 4.0 .

{Ed025's Note - dont try and justify saturdays performance (or non-performance should i say) as a tactical masterstroke jred, jose got it horribly wrong and proved all the supporters who think hes a cretin dead right mate..

18 Oct 2017 19:24:02
Against Chelsea rash and linders where very good
Miki hand lukaku had a mare .
Against Chelsea our passing was good our out balls where good, against the scouse shocking.

Similar tactics 1 good performance 1 bad performance .

18 Oct 2017 19:24:33
It's like we said we were scoring goal, We were getting forward then we went to an field and parked the bus. a bit frustrating.
Now some might say a good point away to Liverpool but for me you have to have a go.

{Ed025's Note - dead right leahy..

19 Oct 2017 09:25:06
WRD, that will be me I guess you’re referring to. I suggested the club find an alternative because Mourinho was talking about working for someone else because apparently his £15 million per year salary is not enough. Also after 18 months he is still living in a hotel. Put these two together and it tells me he has no interest in being at Man Utd. If this is the case, then what is so outrageous about suggesting we find someone who does want the job? What kind of message does his lack of commitment send to others at the club, especially the players?

It’s interesting you mention cowardice; I think you might be on to something. Top sports people need courage wheras Mourinho always bottles it in the big games. Last week’s Liverpool game was the latest example. Even last night we were pretty flat against a fairly poor team. Wheras Spurs had the courage to properly take on Madrid and Liverpool scored a hatful, we huffed and puffed and just about got a win because of a cock up from their keeper. So, you tell me whether that’s us contending and winning well as you say.

I think AJH has pretty much nailed it in his response to your post. Top Managers need to keep innovating and I don’t see Jose doing that. He’s starting to become yesterdays man so instead of all the BS and the bluster, let’s see if he’s got it in him to find an extra gear and come up with something different. Our aspiration is to be the best in Europe and we won’t achieve that by hiding everytime we come up against a decent team in a tricky game. I realise by saying this I am also agreeing with Jamie Carragher which is a first.

I’d love to see him do it but I think he’s too arrogant to see what’s required. I think he’ll stay for another year or two then leave for Paris. No doubt he’ll have improved us after the nightmare of Moyes and LvG but we will need someone else to take us to the next level of truly competing with the best.

19 Oct 2017 10:47:24
I’m sure the club are always on the look out and have contingency plans, Jose usually stays 3 years so it wouldn’t surprise me to see him leave after his contract.
Cowardice isn’t a word I’d associate with a man who has won everything in the game, people may not like his tactics in certain games but it generally gets the job done. I just feel it’s a massive overreaction to 1 result which when taken in isolation is a good point, everyone seems to have forgotten that we’ve not lost a single game and in fact won every game bar 2.
It seems fans are never happy, you can’t tell me if at the beginning of the season you’d have been offered being unbeaten with hatfuls of goals but oh there’s be a bit of a bore draw at Anfield you’d go ‘no this isn’t good enough’. I don’t see anyone out there who is better than Jose who can take us to the next level, Poch- won nothing, Klopp- gone nowhere, Pep- has found the Prem a struggle, who else? Nobody for me.
I feel the actual debate really is if people prefer style or substance.

19 Oct 2017 17:39:05
WRD; why can't we have both? This is Manchester Utd we are talking about. Serial winners with a tradition of playing high quality football.

When faced with difficult opposition the way Mourinho plays lacks courage. It takes bravery to believe in your own abilities and to try and impose yourself on quality opposition. It's this self belief which makes the difference between winners and talented also rans.

The problem with Jose's approach just at a practical level (nevermind stylistically) is fourfold:

Firstly it undermines the players self belief. His approach says to them that they aren't good enough to beat the other team. This then becomes self fulfilling.

Secondly, it's old hat and managers can work out what to do against it. Like Mourinho said; he was stumped because Klopp left three energetic midfielders on the pitch. If he didn't know how to beat a team because they do this then he needs a rethink. Wenger was once fresh and new but didn't re-invent himself. Mourinho is going the same way.

THirdly, its accepting of losing a certain amount of points - if we go for a draw at all the away games at top six clubs then we are deliberately trying to forfeit 12 points which are their to play for. Those 12 points could lose us the league.

Forthly, this pragmatic approach is not enough against the best. We couldn't even beat Liverpool using it so what chance does this approach have against Madrid, Barca, Juve, Bayern, City etc especially in a knock out competition?

We should be aspiring to go toe to toe and beat these teams, not hiding away from them. You say Jose wins stuff and he has. That isn't to say he will continue to win in the future.

Our ambition is the league not the league cup and the champions league not the cup winners cup. To achieve this our team and our manager need the courage to believe in their own abilities

Parking the bus.



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