23 Nov 2015 09:51:18
How many times has David De Gea come to our rescue over the past 18 months? I have honestly lost count of the amount of points he has single handedly gained this club. He is for me the best goalkeeper we have ever had, better than VDS and the Great Dane in my opinion. He is elite, absolutely elite.
Against Watford I feel we again stole three points due to the heroics of DDG and another huge chunk of luck with the OG (there seems to be a recurring theme here) . I am glad for the points but saddened by Herrera's injury and I almost cried when I saw Van Gaal's substitution. It killed the games feel which was an enjoyable opening 20 minutes.
Quick note on the defence, I am glad to see us conceding few goals but the amount of help given to them by the central midfielders is unbelievable. A lot of the time we literally have six defenders and I believe this is making the defence seem better than what it actually is at the moment. It is also why we cannot fluidly and rapidly get forward with momentum. Fergie once said Man Utd liked to make life hard for themselves. Under Van Gaal they have just been hard to watch.
23 Nov 2015 11:19:11
If we had taken our chances, the game would have been done and dusted. Also, I recall De Gea making one monster save. The other shots that Watford had in the second half were straight at him.
I suppose every one see's different things when they watch a game of football, because I thought we deserved to win that game with the chances we created.
Up until Herrera went off, we were playing some nice stuff. There was plenty of movement in the forward areas. After Herrera and Jones went off, the team shape changed which didn't do us any favours.
23 Nov 2015 11:25:03
i would agree with all of that.
23 Nov 2015 11:42:35
turo
like you say watfords chances went straight at ddg, if they had taken there chances it could of been done and dusted.
like u say " everyone sees different things "
23 Nov 2015 11:50:54
Better than the great Dane? Let's not get carried away. Schmeichel did it at the top level for many years to the point he intimidated some forwards.
23 Nov 2015 11:53:02
We had 6 shots on target, Watford 5. So I am not sure what your point is. We were not lucky to win by any stretch. Their keeper also pulled off a couple of fantastic saves. I mean, isn't that what they are paid to do?
23 Nov 2015 11:53:30
DDG, VDS, Peter Sch are world class. DDG is tested more frequently. I think DDG just edges VDS and Peter Sch in the ball passing category. DDG has the long range point to point missile in his armory.
23 Nov 2015 11:53:49
DDG positioned himself perfectly - I think Romero's head would still be in orbit if that first Deeney effort had connected with him.
Agree with everything Maze. A draw would have been fair, they way we started we could have battered them. I don't like how clinical we have to be, missing a couple of clear chances is normal in a game, all of a sudden its vital we finish everything we create. It's like LVG and some fans expect us to score every chance we create which is just ridiculous, we need to score them because we hardly create!
Lingard's first one on one wasn't exactly easy either. The lob was though, but that was it really.
23 Nov 2015 12:08:55
turo
who said anything about being lucky?
like u say watford had 5 shots on target not including the pen, so if they had taken there chances they would of won 6:2 .
but they never, i just don't agree with the comment that if we had taken our chances the the game would be over, because that can apply to both teams pal.
23 Nov 2015 12:11:01
missed the part about the great dane, best gk ever imo.
23 Nov 2015 12:12:25
Keepers are paid to make saves, David is world-class no doubt but only one was what is call a top save. That's what separates the best from the rest.
But I agree with the sentiment that he does win us many games over a course of a season. U pay a striker 250k a week to score u goals to win a game likewise u pay a keeper top wack to stop them at the other end.
I also thought we thoroughly deserved to win.
23 Nov 2015 12:12:28
I think the problem in the second half was the shape. I don't think it was a wise move to go to three at the back. The 4222 system we used in the first half was working a treat.
At the end of the day, what, if's and maybe's has no bearing on the reality of the situation: We won. How many hours have we gone without conceding a goal from open play? Second in the league. I think we have a genuine chance of winning the league this season. How many here thought we would be challenging for a league title only a year and a half after the disastrous Moyes' tenure?
I, like many, want to see us ripping teams a new one, but that isn't the way the manager sets up; and I personally don't have a problem with that because I can only think of a handful of teams over the past ten years or so who played a high tempo attacking game, and were successful (United included) .
23 Nov 2015 12:36:16
I think for 20 minutes in the 2nd half Watford deserved a point, they came at us because we had failed to kill the game off, don't think we were lucky to get the win, we worked hard to create chances after they scored the equaliser and ok it was an own goal but not like he chipped it over his keeper from 30 yards under no pressure, it just hit him because Bastian put it back across the goal for that to happen.
De Gea is amazing, it is very easy to forget how good Schmeichel was, to say DDG is winning us matches on his own, Pete did that all the way through the 90s, people seem to think we won every match 5-0 and our keeper never had anything to do. If you want to look at it the same way he single handedly won us the league against Newcastle with 4 world class saves one year.
Everybody remembers the Giggs goal against Arsenal but we wouldn't have been in extra time if it hadn't been for a penalty save and two other world class saves from Schmeichel who was struggling with a back injury, so again if you look at it the same way he single handedly won us the treble as well.
I think DDG is class, that is what you pay the big money for as someone else said, but he needs to do it for a lot longer for me to be better than the Great Dane.
23 Nov 2015 13:15:52
Id say de Gea was the 3rd best we've had ahead of Gregg and Bailey but behind van der Saar and Schmeichel.
Edwin was part of a world record setting defence and big Pete made saves like that every season especially 96 and 99
De Gea though has time to become the best.
23 Nov 2015 13:22:50
i think ddg is a better gk than vds.
23 Nov 2015 13:54:42
VDS was our best. Pete was a great keeper but too much ego and mouth for my liking. VDS was fantastic in every aspect, but particularly in organising a defence.
I expect DDG to eclipse them all though. Just turned 25, easily has another decade at the top level, and is getting better every season.
23 Nov 2015 13:56:32
I think its close between them. As I said Dave has time on his side.
23 Nov 2015 14:24:46
I can't believe no-one has mentioned Massimo Taibi :O)
I was at the Liverpool game when he made his debut. That game sticks out in particular as it was my first Liverpool/United game I went too. When he went up to collect a ball from a free kick and allowed Hypia to score, I always remember my Uncles reaction and words, which I can't repeat here lol.
De Gea is an unbelievable shot stopper. His reactions are lightening quick as well. I don't think he has the presence of the big Dane and VDS in goal though. That said, If I had to choose between the three, It would be a difficult decision. I would probably go with peter Schmeichel though. He was my idol as a kid.
23 Nov 2015 14:49:23
Real close between DeGea and Schmeichel for the best.
Cant believe no ones mentioned Mark Bodgeit, I mean Bosnich.
23 Nov 2015 14:53:06
DDG is a very good goalkeeper, one of the best in the world at the moment and growing in stature. Stature and imposition of his will over the attacker is what set Schmeichel apart from any other keepers I have seen. The Dane was the best I have seen, and I luckily saw Clemence, Jennings and Shilton at their peak. Schmeichel was exceptional at one on ones, unbelievable and his stature gave us that image of invincibility at the back, get past our defence and there is the giant commanding Dane. I think DDG is starting to build that stature but isn't there yet so doesn't compare just yet. The point sounds like an argument is that DDG being so good hides the paucity of LVG's team.
We won, but I do think the change to 3.5.2 was too easy, too quick as if it was what LVG wanted all along. Before that we were in control and the change held us back. When Herrera went off I felt we might have been a little braver with the substitution rather than changing the formation.
Interesting point about SAF saying we make it difficult for ourselves. For too long we made it difficult because we failed to control games, failed to control possession at key times and for years we acknowledged the European teams held the ball better and is one reason why SAF was not as successful in Europe as he should have been. LVG is trying to instil that possession and control of a game, it is a building process because he is fundamentally changing so much of our playing method.
23 Nov 2015 15:00:08
Top post, Redman.
I think who ever takes over when LVG he leaves, will inherit a team that will be up there with the best of them.
23 Nov 2015 15:15:51
to much is made of fergy only winning 2 CL imo.
to start with the english game was miles behind the top teams in europe for a large part of the 90s .
also the simple truth is its also hard to win which is why no team have done it year on year .
you can't forget that we lost 2 finals to 1 of, if not the best club team and player of all time in messi and barcelona.
23 Nov 2015 15:20:43
Red Man,
Your last paragraph is spot on as far as I am concerned. I also felt like the OP was saying De Gea being so good is hiding how bad the rest of the team are, which I don't really think is the case, a good team needs a good goalkeeper, he is part of the team. I just couldn't be bothered with the argument.
23 Nov 2015 15:48:01
you defend as a unit .
whats changed from last season, imo schneiderlin .
i don't think we have a great back 4, the shaw injury is a big blow but add schneiderlin and ddg and its a good unit .
the issue for me is we are so defensive it affects our attack.
23 Nov 2015 15:49:12
gds redman
thats not like yous 2 ;)
23 Nov 2015 15:59:36
jred,
I agree, we need to find that balance going forward now. We are scoring a fair few though, we just need to have a bit more of an attacking mindset and we could do something special this season.
23 Nov 2015 16:45:52
gds
i think something will have to change i don't think we will win the the league with this style to be honest .
23 Nov 2015 18:55:19
I think DDG is more agile where the big dane was a more intimidating figure with anything coming into the box and even played bigger. Hard to say who was better as they played in a different era and against different teams and different style of football. DDG is definitely better in reflex saves.