09 Sep 2015 00:32:15
This site has been polluted with sack him / give hime time debates over the last few weeks.
In the opinion of our posters or our eds, if the following was put on the table what would be acceptable or preferred
1. Stick with LVG, Win league in 2017 playing with the style we are watching with a good solid squad with good balance. Squad filled with foreign, aging players with a high level of investment required year on year for upkeep.
2. Sack LVG right now, bring new manager in with attacking style playing exiting driven fast football ala olsen, sharpe, giggs, ronaldo (just left side for reference), champions league qualification each year and title honours within 3 years. Imported squad with low level of academy input.
3. As per option 2 but a 5 year wait for title honours filled with youth academy players and repeat success
4. Ala Arsenal, Excitement but win f all.
Just curious
09 Sep 2015 01:34:26
No. 2 to an extent but No. 1 is very misleading as you have put 'win the title in 2017' which sorry to burst your bubble my friend, no matter what he invests, he will not win a major trophy as manager of Manhester United.
09 Sep 2015 02:17:34
jered he has got us to champions league a easy group have faith
and don't say hoe much we spent sick of hearing this
s
09 Sep 2015 07:40:20
all managers need time .
im not sure which option i would pick but i would give lvg until the end of the season and then make a call .
09 Sep 2015 08:12:17
None of those options are a sure thing. You could attempt anyone of them amd fail.
For me the best thing to do now is give LvG until the end of the season. Then see how the land lies. Bringing in a new manager mid season only causes more disruption than if cures.
If for whatever reason it becomes apparent the LvG can't remain in the job during the season then Giggs as a temp until the season finishes is best regardless of who is available. Anyone who we then decide to offer the job to can come in and work with Giggs in an advisory role until the end of the season. But that's all ifs and maybes.
Regardless of who is in charge we need to heavily invest in our academy. And we needs to remind whoever is in the job of their responsibilities to our traditions and our future.
I'm not so worried about the specifics of tactics just that we try and play in an entertaining way. Whether that be possession, counter attacking or pressing. Football goes in cycles, chasing after the in vogue style is silly but we will still be influenced by it.
{Ed001's Note - what manager would be willing to come in on an advisory role to Giggs? You would have to remember that any success Giggs had would immediately make their position untenable as a replacement. If Giggs wasn't successful with their advice, they would immediately have a huge section of the crowd on their backs as they had not been able to help Giggs. It is a lose lose for a new manager to have any involvement prior to taking over.}
09 Sep 2015 08:40:25
For me, if Giggs is to be our manager at some point, he needs to go elsewhere for a good number of years, get experience and prove himself worthy of such a huge role. If he can't then he doesn't get the opportunity. Too much of a risk otherwise, for me.
09 Sep 2015 09:24:07
I think managers coming in mid season isn't always a bad thing in fact it can be good to evaluate the squad for a few months to see what changes you may or may not have to implement over the preseason.
Ed001 is correct about Giggs. Look at what happened at Chelsea with Di Matteo, put simply he was in temporary charge but they couldn't just outright sack him as he just won the CL so they persevered with a manager who deep down they knew wasn't experienced enough to do the job properly. Is that the type of thing you would like to see possibly happen to Giggs Shappy?
Ed002 said that Klopp has been offered the chance to work in a behind the scenes capacity at a club for a few months before being handed the reins which to me makes perfect sense. I have no idea what club Ed002 speaks of (although I have my suspicions) but to me whomever has conjured up this plan has a very good understanding of the game, understands the importance of communication between playing staff and coaching staff as well as the key need to begin building personal relationships.
09 Sep 2015 09:44:58
I don't think I explained it well, I ment more as a behind the scenes take stock and ascess the situation while Giggs maintains some stability.
If LvG was sacked the club would have to be in a bad state at the time limiting any success he could have.
I can't imagine the club sacking a manager while the club is still in the champions league for example.
09 Sep 2015 10:11:06
Sack him now and get rid of the academy all together. With more and more money in the game we are just ruining young talent, like most other top teams do. They are not given a chance and are sent on loan to lower level teams, where as if we left the potential stars to teams like Everton/West Ham/Southampton and below, they would be given games and then we can buy them when they are ready for the standard. Stones, Barkley wouldn't be getting a kick now if they had come through a CL teams youth development.
All young kids want to play for the top teams so they will choose one of us in the "hope" they make it, when in reality they would have a much better chance later in their careers having real football under their belt.
Football has moved on, it's time we did to.
I won't bother going into why LVG needs to go as I have done that to death.
09 Sep 2015 10:29:38
Beast,
Let me get this right, you think we should have no academy and no manager?
09 Sep 2015 10:42:48
Scrap the academy Beast? Come on mate that's the biggest lot of Bastian Schweinstiger I have heard. I see what you are trying to say about young kids getting more time and more chances at lesser reputation clubs but we must strive to improve our academy not just dismiss it.
There is problems within our academy that is plain for us all to see and it needs someone to come in with a plan to revamp the whole system which I hope happens sooner rather than later (it won't happen under LVG as he likes splashing the cash too much).
Without that academy we would never have witnessed a Beckham free kick at Old Trafford, we would never have seen the masterclass of Scholes, we would never have seen the genuis of Giggs or the passion of Neville. We need to get back to the days were we focussed on educating kids in the art of success.
09 Sep 2015 11:05:40
There is too much money involved now mate. Young players will get less and less opportunities the more money that is pumped in. Teams are weaker when they blood youngsters, competition will capitalise on teams that try to do what most of us think is the right thing. CL clubs won't do it if they want to stay at the top.
I would love us to have a youth structure and a team of players loyal to the club having dreamed of playing for us, but that isn't reality. The game is global now, argument says a less capable kid with more first team experience will develop quicker than a child prodigy who spends their time on the bench or loaned to lesser clubs with lesser coaching/facilities. What we have seen with Southampton will be how it works moving forward for most teams.
Sad but true, why would we spend 4 years grooming a player for the first team when we can just buy a ready made talent 4 years later and not have the team suffer during that 4 year period? Too much at stake now, football is losing it's soul, but we have to move with the times.
P.S - A benefit is that England will produce better players if less of them end up rotting at CL clubs.
{Ed002's Note - Just to be clear, it is not possible for Premier League sides not to have an academy/youth set up.}
09 Sep 2015 11:13:35
How does lvg like splashing the cash? He's only addressing a decade of chronic under investment under our glorious owners and having to replace the post 2008 duds Fergie bought when starved of cash. This spending is well overdue.
And also how many overage foreign players do we have going back to the original post.
09 Sep 2015 11:33:18
Mort I am not going to get into this again but the manager has spent mammoth sums since taking over and we are still nowhere near the elite clubs in my view. LVG has spashed cash at every club he has taken over that is fact.
Ed002 when you say it is not possible for clubs in the PL not to have a youth academy is this a rule? Also if it was possible not to have a youth set up would clubs be interested in getting rid of it?
{Ed002's Note - Clubs are required by the rules to have an approved academy and to run a number of teams from the age of, I think, 9 years old and up. The second wuestion is moot.}
09 Sep 2015 11:49:13
I'd say take Klopp or Pep at the end of the season. Two guys who could be here for 10 years if they wanted to and were successful.
They still play possession football, but with real attacking intent. The squad is perfect for Pep to take over. Small but pretty good in terms of quality, quite a few young players but room for one or two major signings.
09 Sep 2015 13:02:13
Don't remember splashing much cash at Ajax or az.
And you skipped the point. Due to the owners and or fergusons reticence to spend or spending on players who flopped moyes inherited a poor squad. Moyes himself said it with his we need more world class players line. Lvg inherited an unbalanced squad.
This spending is well over due. Yes I agree the squad isn't complete yet. But would you have preferred us to have not spent anything?
I really don't get the issue with spending. Its all money generated by the club mainly sponsors money. I'm sure they want to see it spent. Its our cash not the owners. i'd rather ser it go on players than someone's bank account.
09 Sep 2015 17:48:14
Mort
Agreed I don't see why people get hung up on amounts although possibly they are being strung along by the anti United press who constantly use amounts to trash us. For me lvg came in and set out a plan, then has been decisive with the sales of players. I don't care how much we spend it isn't my money and if it needs it I hope they will spend plenty more