20 Aug 2015 18:32:38
Strebor,
You asked me if I think Rooney is good enough to lead the line for us, and the answer is I don't know.
Physically he has the attributes, he's certainly intelligent enough but it just doesn't seem to be clicking and I have no idea for why.
I would guess and say it might be down to the fact he hasn't played as an out and out striker for near on 5 years.
But a player of his ilk should be able to handle it.
Then I look at the fact he's been playing 30 a season since he was 16.
Most players start at 20 and hit that wall at 33ish.
If a play has a 13-15 year career typically then
rooney would be 13 years into his career and thus he may be showing the signs of a player slowing down.
All I really know is that I do not doubt the ability of the man, what I do doubt is whether this change has come a few years to late.
20 Aug 2015 19:08:02
This is exactly the problem in my mind as well. He was a man well before his years, he has played a hell of a lot and it's going to catch up with anybody let alone somebody with Rooney's build and propensity to put on weight. I bet he works a lot harder than most in training as well to maintain fitness, couple that with the already long career it is a problem.
We are seeing a 33 year old Rooney in my eyes and that is the problem. His touch, pace and mobility are all declining, it is why we see so many basic errors. Also interesting to see the few offsides against Villa, strikers do this if they are naïve or worried about their pace, he clearly isn't naïve, but just like RVP he is starting to doubt himself and potentially will get caught offside more and more. (a bit too soon to judge on offsides as it was one game, but something to consider).
20 Aug 2015 19:50:41
He has played in the first team since a young age so he could well be burnt out. A human body is like a machine, no matter how good it is one day it will start to fall apart and you'll need to replace it.
You may have hit the nail on the head about him nearing the end of his career, but only time will tell if that's true.
I think next summer a replacement will be bought in and that's when we'll see him slowly be fazed out of the first team. But in the meantime I still see him banging in 20+ goals this season and beat that record, he just needs a bit of confidence to set himself up.
20 Aug 2015 19:44:48
José , generally a fair assessment. But I would have to disagree with your quote "he's certainly intelligent enough". Rooney may be a lot of things , but intelligent ain't one of them!
Also , in terms of slowing down early because of his career starting at a young age , it would certainly help his cause if he behaved like a professional athlete and looked after himself properly. Nobody to blame but himself there. Cigarettes , booze and fast food do not bode well for a professional sportsman (well , unless it's darts!).
Don't suppose banging grannies helps either :)
20 Aug 2015 19:56:48
Players develop at different rates so when he burst onto the scene people saw his age and thought he could improve for the next 10 years but really he was already pretty much fully developed and hasn't really improved. He was still a top player at his prime but unfortunately his prime was a few years ago
20 Aug 2015 21:06:39
Not doubting you here Betty but I have never seen images of Rooney smoking? Plus if he was ever caught in a fast food restaurant surely there would be media coverage (due to how pathetic British media is) or maybe I've been silly and missed something?
Maybe he naturally puts on weight when not training every day, which is still his fault because he should be aiming to stay fit during pre-season.
20 Aug 2015 21:15:10
Moon fairly spot on analysis. Fergie also saw that his talent was waning and knew he would still have got a fair whack of money had he sold him a few seasons ago. I still think he will score a good few goals this season maybe not 20+ that people have stated but maybe around or just under the 20 mark, I hope for our sakes at least. Going forward, leading the line for Man Utd, I'm sure they will be looking for someone to replace for next season.
As regards to the intelligence point, he has always had plenty of football intelligence but would question how far he would get on the chase
Confidence also seems to be a massive issue, hopefully he grabs a goal or two against Newcastle and can build from there. I feel sorry for him from a footballing perspective as he has played an awful lot since the age of 16 and there has always been massive pressure on his shoulders. At 28 he should be in his absolute prime but instead seems to be on the downward spiral. Let's hope there is still something left there and he can bang in a few more goals and get a few more titles under his belt. Regardless of what people think of him and they way he conducted his business in the past, there is no doubt that every time he pulled on that red shirt he gave 100 percent as if he was a red devil all his life
20 Aug 2015 21:16:49
I'm not a Rooney fan as in I think his basic errors show he's declining which a lot of us have said for a while not but I do agree he is intelligent, he sees things but I don't know if he is able to execute that pass, that touch anymore.
20 Aug 2015 21:33:29
That's he tends to holiday in Vegas.
20 Aug 2015 21:43:32
Not trying to be cynical here Weggy , but the most motivated I have ever seen Rooney to get in good shape was just prior to his new contract under Moyes. Maybe it is just coincidence , I do not know , but he was fitter , leaner and totally motivated up to that new contract. Since that contract was signed , he has looked a different player to me. Probably not deliberately , but I think more than likely it is complacency.
Not trying to turn this into a Rooney bashing , but does anyone honestly see the same desire and fitness now that he showed in the first few months under Moyes?
As for the bit about drinking and smoking and food ( I think I read somewhere that he is quite partial to chips in particular?) , I think it is fairly well known that Rooney struggles with fitness. Body shape and all that play a part , but I just don't think Rooney looks after himself as well as he probably should.
Maybe one of the Eds has an opinion on this?
20 Aug 2015 21:56:51
Betty, that would have been top banter from an opposition fan.
20 Aug 2015 22:58:24
Rooney is one of the most intelligent footballers I've ever seen, his positional sense, reading of the game, etc. all show this.
His run to pull both central defenders away from Depay on tuesday were world class and I can think of very few players who could do that.
I simply think Wayne Rooney is starting to slow down and I have no issues with that, he's given his career to this club so I hope we don't just sell him off because he's slowing down.
Would you have sold Giggs when he played central? Scholes when he couldn't finish games? Ferdinand when he lost his pace? No because they're all regarded as United legends just as I think Rooney should be.
21 Aug 2015 02:27:54
Coouldnt agree more Moon, you don't get to be Englands and (nearly) Uniteds top goal scorer with a lack of football inteligence. I mentioned this the other day, that his intelligent movement and clever touches to bring others in to play, is Rooneys best asset, and ED001 spat his cornflakes over his screen (apparently) lol. But i'm going to stand by my conviction and say that the reason LVG rates him highly is because of how he can play in almost any system, and a number of posistions. Granted his NO. 9 days are behind him by the looks of it, but he's still a top player. As for commitment, I watched an interview with several united players a few weeks back, and the general consensus is Wayne is the hardest working in training, so clearly its his body type that let's him down, which obviously isn't his fault.
{Ed001's Note - but he plays those positions badly because of his lack of intelligent movement!}
21 Aug 2015 06:19:23
Intelligent movement? Nonsense. The majority of the time Rooney is like a schoolboy footballer , just following the ball.
I may be a little harsh on Rooney about his fitness and how he looks after himself , but don't try to tell me he is an intelligent player.
21 Aug 2015 10:53:36
Rooney is a very intelligent footballer, I don't know how you guys see otherwise. His ball sense, knowing when to pick a pass, staying onside, the guy even has enough vision to know when to chip a keeper (ask David James) :P