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13 Feb 2015 15:00:31
Sorry for the delay - been out shopping with the Mrs - horrible!

JMB - Moyes in a heartbeat, he is wrong for sure but he is not as wrong as LVG is - the problems Moyes had were ten times more difficult to solve than the ones LVG has (mostly of his making) and I firmly believe if Moyes was in charge this season and LVG last we would have done worse last season and would be doing much better this season.

Don't get me wrong LVG has a better set of characteristics to be the Utd boss and on paper you pick LVG all day long, however he has too much of what we would consider the good stuff following Moyes: You need ego, confidence, experience, a winners mentality (to a degree), to have courage, tactical awareness. But all of these positive traits can turn toxic if you have too many of them, that is our problem with LVG. We had a weaker manager in Moyes who was overwhelmed, however LVG is too much of everything we needed, too arrogant, too stubborn, too tactically focussed destroying players individuality and most worryingly he has nothing to lose and everything to gain by being this way in order to say "I told you so" regarding his philosophy.

LVG is a tyrant who will systematically destroy the club in his quest to be proven correct about his philosophy (given the chance), that is much more concerning than a manager out of his depth and basically on a hiding to nothing from the get-go. That's where I stand, and I know Moyes was a disaster waiting to happen, LVG is a catastrophe though in my view, (just to avoid the usual stuff about Moyes again)

Red Man - Virtually any team would be in the FA Cup if they had had our fixtures, the FA Cup doesn't mean much at all anymore unfortunately - it's gone the way of Internationals, sad but true.

LVG is nowhere near winning the league which was his target and our target, the 3rd place CL thing is a financial target only not a footballing one. He has the ingredients to make Michelin Star meals but keeps turning out Beans on Toast. Nothing wrong with that now and again of course, but a good manager would have learnt by his mistakes. You can't compare us to Arsenal etc, because we have better players, resources, pedigree etc, all that stock we built up until 2011ish has been eroding in recent years, to the point where Burnley rightly fancy their chances in our own backyard.

Not one person can hand on heart say that LVG is guaranteed to do well, they can only hope he will turn out well. All the logical money would be on him failing, because all the evidence to date indicates he is no further along with his plan than when he first proposed it. There has been no progress just talk and excuses.

I like all of us want us to win and play well, the sad fact is we are luckily picking up points and playing terribly - luck runs out and that is what quite a few supporters are worried about. We are closer to not finishing in the European Places than we are to winning the league as it stands, despite all of the massive advantage the manager has had over both our rivals and previous managers of Utd going back to Atkinson etc.

Just my view of course, but I stand by it still.

Agree9 Disagree10

13 Feb 2015 15:14:40
Got to say I agree with everything beast has said here. To many valid points to ignore,and I don't think that he is being negative on this one just realistic of the possibility of lvg's ego getting the best of what's best for the team and the club to progress in the way it deserves.

13 Feb 2015 16:57:04
I think beast has a bigger ego than LVG and is maybe just a little more stubborn )

Its not about ego Ken, it's about having the decency to answer the questions put to me by fellow posters.

You can't tell me every game is luck?

maybe a few times in games we have gotten away with it but its not luck,

theres a reason we have lost 1 game since november and that's down lvg and the team not giving up.

how many times last season would we have lost games we have scrapped a draw or win this season?

you can't say oh its lucky. its called fighting spirt.

what more do you want? to win every game 5-0 having 100% possession.

what did u expect from last season? a total dominance in football because we spent a lot of money which given the squad needed investment.

we were getting beaten easily, not looking like a team that was going win games and that's why we finished so low down.

lvg has come in and we are one of the hardest teams to beat, we might not play fast tika taka football but that was never the plan, the plan was to get this team back to the confindence and level they should be at.

13 Feb 2015 17:09:59
Its just my opinion which is based on about as fact much fact as some of your opinions

Ken - yeah I get it you don't agree with me.

Spb - Of course it isn't all luck, just we rely on it far too much this season. We aren't putting 11 clowns on the pitch, they are the best paid group of players on the planet collectively so they will naturally apply a lot of skill and whilst I don't like LVG he isn't a total person (he wouldn't have been hired otherwise). The problem is we are performing like a lower PL team in most matches this season.

The league is competitive and we often see lower teams beating higher ones. I would like us to perform like a team befitting our station more often that is all, even QPR look good now and again!

My expectations are not too high, it is more than reasonable to expect the manager to take learnings from each game and apply them, its' more than reasonable to expect a team with such undoubted attacking talent to create and show more than what they have been. That is my point, if we were Burnley I would be happy with our displays this season, but we are not Burnley, we just approach games like we are!

Yeah I agree we should be playing better football given the players we have,

But to go from the tripe last season which I believe is worse than this season to then play exciting football.

I believe the manager is over protecting the defence which is having an effect on our attacking play, but it's working ATM.

We will just have to wait and see, if come next season we have CL and lvg gets the players to make our team balanced as he keeps saying then we should expect the style to be a lot more entertaining.

But for now we should be satisfied with the position were in and how things have gone from last season.

13 Feb 2015 19:20:43
Dear Mr Beast,

Going through your latest doomsday post, it just dawned on me how much it says about you than it says about LVG. Wow!! packaging all those views and opinions and presenting them as facts.Damn!! your Ego must be Huge. Perhaps the FA cup might not mean anything to the likes of you but it still means a lot to some of us out there and so unlike you, winning it will be a big deal irrespective of how and which team we play in the finals if we get there.

Well, after shopping with the Mrs any husband would need to blow off a bit of steam. Personally I am allergic to all retail establishments, on line or off, except grocery stores.

I think many of us are coming round to Beast's way of thinking.

Instead of adapting to the exigencies of the EPL, it seems like LVG wants not just United to yield to his philosophy, but the whole league. As such he is looking very much like a square peg in a round hole. Cliches like you can't teach an old dog new tricks spring to mind.

I hope we make 4th if only because I want more midweek football, but there are 4 very good well organized teams just behind us, all playing much better football.

LVG said it was going to take until Xmas to see the philosophy taking hold. Did he mean 2015? Hopefully it well gel sooner than that.

I love it how a few of you are saying that "My Ego" must be huge? It doesn't even make sense, you don't know me, my opinions are simply that "opinions". I am not acting on them, I am not firing LVG, I am not picking the team, signing players, I am not impacting your lives in any way. I am simply stating my views on a banter website, not a TV screen or a pedestal harassing ignorant people with a senseless placard wrapped around my chest.

I am not speaking down to anybody, I am not calling anybody stupid or immature for holding opposite opinions to myself. Not once I have mocked or berated any one of you for holding different views.

I think in psychology its called "transference", stop shooting the messenger is my advice, if you can't handle the truth then I am wasting my time.

Beast, every game we've won has been lucky? What a load of utter rubbish. All the other teams have had their share of luck.
If you're just critisizing lvg for the sake of it, then that's your problem. But 1 loss in 18 speaks for itself and if it was all luck then we should ask lvg for next week's lottery numbers!!
It is really mind boggling how some some people can twist everything to suit their argument. If you stick to the linen that we're playing unattractive football, then I'll be right behind you, but to be telling us that we're lucky and all the teams round us are going to start playing like Brazil while we completely lose the plot is baseless.

The overreactions that follow beasts posts are crazy if others were to post similar then it wouldn't register the same reaction's, if folk calm down and look at what beast is saying then you would realize that he has some valid points, with the games we have coming up and the teams around us how many of you would put your mortgage on us finishing top four.

Why are so many people afraid of the other teams we have the 3rd best defence, 2nd best home record and a good goal difference.

we have only lost to southampton n city from the teams around us.

makes me laugh were 3rd and people still are not satified.

after last year what were u all expecting.

14 Feb 2015 02:23:50
Oh you have a new fanboy beastie boy.

{Ed007's Note - Aawww diddums, do you need a hug? (finger)

Beast

You said the FA cup doesn't mean much at all anymore. So in 2003 when we were struggling under SAF the Millwall win meant nothing. The League cups won when we were struggling no doubt were worthless and heaven help those years SAF struggled, played poor football and won nothing at all. Were you calling for SAF's head in those years?

Beast
"Moyes in a heartbeat, he is wrong for sure but he is not as wrong as LVG is - the problems Moyes had were ten times more difficult to solve than the ones LVG has (mostly of his making) and I firmly believe if Moyes was in charge this season and LVG last we would have done worse last season and would be doing much better this season"

I could not disagree more strongly with your comment. Your hatred of all things LVG is blinding your objectivity. Again I will say that the momentum and fear factor were lost when appointing Moyes, opposition fans absolutely loved it. LvG may have spent a lot but the opposition were no longer afraid, even the pro's were saying even the promoted teams fancied their chances against us. Appointing LvG last season would not have pleased me but we would not have lost such a level of our fear factor as we did, if a higher profile manager had been appointed.

One thing is that LvG has come in and started weeding out those that needed it, it should have started last season.

14 Feb 2015 11:53:25
Red Man, do you really think we have got the fear factor back this season?

Burnley, years ago, would have camped round their own 18 yard box, and hoped for not too bad a duffing.

They came to OT and for large parts of the game had us under real pressure, and took the game to us.

Leicester? West Ham? Southampton?

Teams we would have been banking on for three points in the past, are no longer rolling over for us.

We may have lost that fear factor under Moyes last season, but there is nothing I have seen this season to suggest LVG has miraculously made it come back.

StevieK

No I don't believe we have the fear factor back, that will take time, confidence, performances and results. I expect us to be active in summer and make a strong start to next season, whoever is manager and then we may see fear of us again.

15 Feb 2015 11:36:24
I hope so, Red Man. I had very strong doubts about LVG when he was appointed (and not because he replaced Moyes!), and I haven't seen too much so far to make me change my mind.

At least the squad itself is an improvement on what we had recently, so we at least have something to work with should he be replaced in the summer.





 

 

 
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